Prof. S. Ratnajeevan H. Hoole
Dedicated to the Memory and Heritage of the Democrat, Peace-maker, Tamil Leader, and Martyr to the Tamil Cause, Appapillai Amirthalingam on the occasion of his 90th Birthday Celebrations at the Jaffna Public Library Auditorium at 4:00 pm on Sunday 3 Sept. 2017.
Presiding: The Rt. Rev. Dr. S. Jebabanesan;
Chief Guest: Hon. R. Sampanthan, Leader of the Opposition.
Special Guest: Attorney Kanaha Manoharan of Canada
wo news items from India this week have parallels to Sri Lanka. First, the persecution watchdog Open Doors reported that Indian Christians experienced almost as many attacks in the first half of 2017 as in all of 2016. Second, Gurmeet Ram Rahim Singh, a self-styled guru was sentenced to 20 years in prison for the “custodial rape” of 2 underage followers by a judge who called him a wild beast. Investigations are pending on 40-50 complaints by other women. Riots by his followers resulted in 38 further deaths.
Are we Sri Lankans any better?
Attacks on Sri Lankan Churches
Attacks on Christians in Sri Lanka are well-documented. Cardinal Malcolm Ranjith’s surprising denial of such attacks (documented by attorney Lakshan Dias), added tongue-in-cheek (or perhaps foot-in-mouth) “I do not know whether fundamentalist Christian groups may have attempted to establish churches.” An assertion from a Christian leader that fundamentalist groups have no rights!
The Cardinal, recall, worked for the re-election of President Rajapakse and had his niece Ruwani Cooray appointed second secretary to our French Embassy without passing the required examinations. He also upset Tamil Catholics for urging the US government to go easy on soldiers who engaged in war crimes. Says a US Embassy Cable from WikiLeaks that the Archbishop told the US Ambassador, “pushing the government of Sri Lanka too hard on the war crimes accountability issue now could destabilize Sri Lankan democracy and could suffer revolution from the right or a coup by the military.”
The Cardinal and his opinions therefore deserve immediate dismissal. However, following his denial, then Minister of Justice and Buddhasasana Wijedasa Rajapaksa demanded a public apology from Lakshan Dias, threatening disbarment. Dias fled the country and is reported to be abroad.
Northern Scene: C.V. Wigneswaran
Like Gurjeet Singh’s followers, our Chief Minister in the words of Veluppillai Thangavelu, “is a devotee of [Matara’s] Premananda who was convicted of raping under-aged orphans living in his [Indian] Ashram and murdering a young engineer Ravi.” His was a double life-imprisonment with an I-Rs 66.4 lakh fine. His victims were Jaffna girls who followed him to India after the 1983 riots.
Wigneswaran shortly after his election (by when Premananda had died in prison) requested PM Modi to release three others convicted for life for raping 13 Sri Lankan Tamil girls, including minors, and conspiring to murder ashram inmate Ravi who objected to the rapes and abortions. Despite the evidence and appeals turned down by the Supreme Court of India, Wigneswaran argued that the convictions were wrong.
In a Thinappuyal interview on 14.04.2017, Wigneswaran was asked about his being a devotee of a convicted criminal. He answered, Jesus Christ was convicted 2000 years ago but people now worship him as God. He said a lot more damaging stuff but the “website has deleted extremely controversial sections of the interview on Wigneswaran’s request” as he feared Catholic outrage (Island 10.05.2017).
Wigneswaran’s Foot in his Mouth
Wigneswaran continues his anti-Christian diatribes. As the veracity of what I have said before has been questioned, I repeat it here with sources. Speaking at the Thirtieth Anniversary Celebrations of the Department of Hindu Religious and Cultural Affairs (Uthayan, front page, 19.11.2016), Wigneswaran first talked up Arumuga Navalar’s brilliance. Then he said that the missionaries knew that local Christians came to work for them only for the money but Navalar was different so the job of Bible translation was given to him and that his knowledge of the Bible exceeded that of the Christian clergy. In reality, Navalar did not translate the Bible into Tamil He joined Principal Percival’s college at the age of 12, and was still a student 13 years later when he, according to the Morning Star, 25.11.1847, walked out with half the boys objecting to Percival admitting Gabriel Jeroni of the toddy-tapping caste. He founded a school for upper castes, but because the teaching there was deficient, most students returned. This puts Wigneswaran’s history in the mythological genre – faith-based wishful thinking transformed into history, abusing the powers of the majority.
Dragging in the Pope
The man cannot help himself. He continues to insult Christians who, comprising 20% of the Jaffna electorate and forming the ITAK-Chelvanayagam base, made Wigneswaran CM. The occasion was an argument with NPC’s S. Thavarasa, who accused Wigneswaran of not delivering. Wigneswaran thereupon claimed that the Pope makes statements repeatedly to see himself in the news, and Thavarasa is doing just that (102nd NPC sitting, 17.08.2017 around 9:30 am; Virakesary 21.08.2017).
Amusingly, the day I read of this, Wigneswaran’s numerous statements in just one newspaper, Thinakkural, were in three pictured articles.
SJV Chelvanayagm Slighted
At the same Hindu Religious and Cultural Affairs celebrations where Wigneswaran spoke, he was followed by his partner in religious hate-speech, Batticaloa District MP Cheeannah Yogeswaran. On that day, Yogeswaran outdid Wigneswaran in his hate for low-castes and Christians.
To describe Yogeswaran, it was in 2006 in Vaharai that my present Parish Priest at St. James’ Nallur, Rev. Fr. Gnanakarunyan, was Assistant Priest. Yogeswaran was an aspiring politician. Their paths crossed when attending to displaced refugees. Yogeswaran, disgustingly, expectorated phlegm and spat at him – the case of a marginal Tamil from Batticaloa trying to assert caste-status by insulting another marginalized Tamil. The irony is that Rev. Gnanakarunyan was unfairly accused under the PTA and spent over a year in jail and yet is called a non-Tamil in Yogeswaran’s speech.
He said (Virakesari, 19.11.2017) that the mark of a race is its religion; that it has been shown that it is Saivites who are Tamils; that the Saivite saints have sung tying up Tamil with Saivism; that all others are Tamil speakers; that only Tamils can be Saivites; and that Navalar’s dreams came true when Wigneswaran, a Saivite, was elected CM. Then the punch-line – obviously referring to the iconic Christian founder of the ITAK, Samuel JV Chelvanayagam: Yogeswaran said, some people had unfortunately been elected violating this Navalar vision as leaders by the people. He added, few come into politics to safeguard Saivism. Navalar’s vision must be upheld. We must follow Saiva culture and eat Saiva food.
Showing his confused mind, he advocated vegetarianism while at once regretting that few temples now have animal sacrifice and asked if this is fair!
The Saiva Juggernaut
The Saiva juggernaut, led by Wigneswaran, is inexorably moving in Jaffna crushing all in its path. A small shrine is built on public land and then expanded – just like the Buddhist temples sprouting up but to which we object. No one dares complain for fear of being accused of being anti-Hindu.
A case in point is the just concluded Nallur Thiruvilla. Point Pedro Road used to run between the temple and its idol’s bath pond. The road was diverted around and the land acquired by the temple. For this year’s festival a largely expanded zone round the temple was fenced off and declared holy ground. To go to my newspaper vendor, I was asked to remove my shoes and walk a large distance, despite the cuds of betel chew spat everywhere. A Hindu friend who lives in the closed zone had to remove his shoes to get home. He asked the police by whose order he had to remove his shoes. It turns out that Shayanthan Kumaradas Maapaana Mudlaiyar, the son of the temple owner, called the police daily to give instructions, which they obeyed, and in turn had special poojas performed for their families.
Now that the festival is over, it is strangely not holy ground any more and we are allowed to walk with shoes again. A grand long-term scheme is transpiring whereby the Nallur Public Library on temple land (across Cross Road) will be built into a second temple, and then the in-between stretch of Point Pedro Road will be taken over, diverting traffic via Cross Road and Navalar Road.
Jaffna University
Normally one would expect the university to lead. Yet the insistence that Council meetings should be vegetarian when most Hindu Council members are voracious carnivores (ironically, the only Christian councilor is vegetarian) shows what little fairness can be expected against the naked demonstration of power to assert Hindu culture on others.
The university has a long history of communalism. Letters called Anglican priest and Senior Lecturer, the late Dr. Jebamohan who vied to be Head of Christian Civilisation, Nalapillai (son of a toddy-tapper) and, contradictorily, even Paraiyah. Similarly, when Roman Catholic Priest, Prof. Pilendran, contested to be Dean/Arts recently, the campaign witnessed a letter circulated saying that a university that refused to accept Prof. Hoole as VC because he is a Christian, should not now accept a Christian as Dean. Pilendran was defeated.
Challenge
Iconic Christians and Christian clergy are under attack. Unable to deliver, Hindu leaders are depicting Christians as the enemy. Dispossessed castes are put down and marginal Hindus are using this for self-elevation. Capacitation by Christian missions is denied. In the name of spirituality, Jaffna is fast losing any semblance of ethics. We need the ITAK to take a strong stand and exercise leadership. Uthayan (31.08.2017) blames Mr. Sampanthan for bringing Wigneswaran into politics and then failing to supervise him. Our franchise is an entrenched right under articles 3 and 4 of the constitution. It cannot be exercised when religion and caste are so freely used to disempower a section of the population.
Tamils have a just struggle for equality in Sri Lanka. Occasionally some Sinhalese admit that we have been wronged. I challenge the Hindus – is there anyone, even one, who would publicly say that we too are wronging our own minorities?
Sinhala_Man / September 2, 2017
Dear Prof Hoole,
As far as I’m concerned, we in Sri Lanka are faced with the problem of reconcilliation after our bitter 30 years war. This is mainly a political problem and you, yourself, have made, and as far as I can see, continue to make, a very positive contribution through your work as one of the Elections Commissioners. Long may you continue to do so! And it is my sincere and fervent prayer (yes, there is a sense in which even guys like me may actually “pray”) that you will succeed in this. I have immense respect for you.
However, it is also my sincere feeling that you are rather simple-minded when dealing with religions. I think that it is an observation that even the most secular-minded would make that there are many instances where religious impulses co-exist with deep piety and virtue. Such instances are to be found among people who DON’T make a song and dance about religion.
*
That religious fanatics are the most dangerous of nuts is something that we all know. In the South we have Gnanasara among the Buddhists; yes, Cardinal Malcolm Ranjith among Christians, plus numerous persons among the Evangelical Churches; and let me see how the Kurunegala Diocese of your own Anglican Church is faring:
http://dioceseofkurunegala.com/
What more does one have to say? This is a man who was sacked from Canterbury for stealing pension money, monthly, for five years from the government (that’s our money!) claiming that his mother-in-law was living. Another “Yahapalana” failure: the guy should be in jail!
Humble guys like me (and more distinguished people like you, Prof. Hoole), are trying not to rouse hatred; however we are all too conscious of fanaticism among those Muslims whom we loosely term fundamentalists. So, this is to be found, even today, in ALL religions in Sri Lanka. I have made some obvious points about the South, since you have demonstrated that things are bad in the North as well. I wonder whether there is some way in which we could invite Prof. Richard Dawkins here for week?
*
To be continued . . .
/
Sinhala_Man / September 2, 2017
. . . Continued:
However, to me it seems that speaking as you have been in Jaffna, you have focussed on the shortcomings of Hinduism, and not very much on those of Christianity.
There are Christian groups for which I have immense respect. However, from what I have gathered of the running of Jaffna College, and Uduvil Girls’ College, the Jaffna Diocese of the CSI also looks pretty corrupt; however, the Boston Donors ( Rev. Richard Huleatt and the rest) seem to be admirable and civilised people. I myself know that in practice, in the running of the S. Thomas’ Colleges, the Anglican Church is terribly manipulative, to the extent of being guilty of criminal behaviour, although I desist from extrapolating to other offences.
*
May I make the point that Christianity has had its share of loonies almost from inception. The very dogmatism of the Nicene Creed points to unseemly intolerance among Christians within a century or two of Jesus Christ (knowing it as well as we both do, I will not try to research all this). And it was there in Protestantism, especially the variety developed in Geneva, Switzerland by Calvin. Do we need to think of anything more than the way he treated this saintly Spanish Protestant and Medical Scientist, Servetus?
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Michael_Servetus
A really nasty lot these Puritans showed themselves in early America, too. Let’s give specifically religious writing a rest and read Hawthorne’s Scarlet Letter and Arthur Miller’s “The Crucible”.
A plague upon ALL religions, I say. If you want to practice them, do so quietly at home: please do not bring them in to the public domain.
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I know that you would have written this article with the best of intentions Prof. Hoole, but I fear that this diatribe of mine will prove to be the kindest comment that you will receive for not letting sleeping dogs lie.
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Sivaruban / September 2, 2017
Sinhala_Man: I have regularly read you with respect. But here I think you are missing the point. This article, I have read it carefully, is not about religion or corruption within this or that religion. It is about about hate speech. EG, what has Jaffna College Corruption got to do with hate speech?
Naga’s generalizations below about Christians converting for money show how wide-spread our communalism is. He swipes at Christians for converting, forgetting how many of us went to Buddhism, came to the Saiva religion, then to the Dutch Church and are now back as Hindus.
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Ajith / September 2, 2017
The article is about the believe of Chief Minister Wigneswaran’s religion, not about hate speech. Wigneswaran has right to believe in any relegion or faith similar to any other individual including Hoole, President Srisena and former President Mahinda Rajapkse. Has Wigneswaran ever given a speech against Sinhala people, Buddhists or Christians. Never. I will challenge if anyone prove that. He never used his faith to influence his political career or his official duties. For some people telling truth is a hate speech. If you are afraid of truth you are an enemy of truth. That is the way I look at Holle’s article.
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Tee Twenty / September 2, 2017
Ajith: Wigneswaran is an elected leader. An elected leader of a community that has not only gone through a lot of suffering, but has also inflicted a lot of suffering on minorities within it over a long period of time through its social structures, and more recently at gun point. The elected leader has a responsibility to show that he is there for ALL, not just those of the majority within us, the minority. He should lead by showing that the Jaffna-domination, Hindu-domination, Upper caste-domination and lamp-post killings are things of the past and our community should move into a new phase. If he holds onto the evils of the past, hiding behind his religious beliefs, he is not going to be the leader we so urgently need.
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Ajith / September 2, 2017
Tee Twenty,
Not only Wigneswaran, but also Mahinda Rajapakase, Srisena, Ranil, Sampanthan, Sumanthiran, Rauf Hakeem etc. all are elected leaders. Every one has their own religious believes and don’t you think you urgently need a real leader to this country which is Sinhala dominated, Buddhist dominated, family dominated, murder dominated, corruption dominated…… Wigneswaran never said that Hinduism should be the NPC’s relegion, Upper caste Jaffna men should only be ministers in his administration, and never an admirer of murders like in the South. It is true Tamils have caste problems, dowry problem, male dominant, regional problem etc. Do you know that most of the Christians school in the Jaffna run by high class Christian Tamils in the past did not admit Hindu students, did not allow to pray Hindu gods in their schools?
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Uthungan / September 3, 2017
Ajith
There is sense in most of what you have said.
But it is not true to say that Christian schools did not allow Hindu students to be admitted nor that they were not allowed to celebrate Hindu events or festivals like Pongal ,Deepavali etc.
Obviously why insit on images of Hindu Gods in a Christian school environment.?
Is not man/ woman an image of God?
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Ajith / September 3, 2017
I am not talking about now or in the very recent past. It happened sometime back. My point is not about God’s image but in a public institution everyone should have the right to follow their religious believes or celebrate their events.
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sach / September 3, 2017
Upper caste Jaffna men should only be ministers in his administration, and never an admirer of murders like in the South.//// LOL
Did not your upper caste Hindu Wigneshwaran admire a megalomaniac murderer like Prabhakaran
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Tee Twenty / September 3, 2017
Ajith: // It is true Tamils have caste problems, dowry problem, male dominant, regional problem etc. // Thank you for this acknowledgement. What are you doing to solve these problems? Don’t you think we have to solve these ourselves with leadership from within than either keep on blaming everybody else or try to solve them by lamp post killings?
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Sinhala_Man / September 5, 2017
Dear Sivaruban,
I’ve been looking carefully at the COMMNENTS. It is as I feared. Not much light has been shed, plenty of heat has been generated. This for me is sad.
It may be that taken paragraph by paragraph, the article may be said to be a plea for fair treatment by minorities, and the need to ensure that their voices be heard.
*
However, it is as I predicted. Far too many have taken this article to be provocative, and taken as a whole, there is another theme running through what has been written: the faults of the Hindus. Let the Hindus correct themselves. When non-Hindus tell them what is wrong with the way they conduct themselves, it seemed to me inevitable that they would refuse to listen. Instead there is far too much about caste, conversions, etc. My claim would be that I foresaw much of this the moment the article appeared. I agree that caste is nasty, and it is becoming obvious to me that it is much more prevalent among “the Tamils” than amongst us. I think that we’ve overcome the worst of it by the more sensible of us not dwelling on it. Make no mistake, caste is prevalent amongst the Sinhalese, and we, too, have still to root out some manifestations of it.
To be continued . . .
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Sinhala_Man / September 5, 2017
Continued . . .
So, am I advocating that “the minorities” in the North grin and bear? That you should be patient in a cowardly sort of way? That may be the case, but I’m not going to get in to arguments justifying what I’m advocating.
I do NOT believe that Truth will always triumph. However, I do believe that if we refuse to descend to the level of our antagonists, many of the more sensible among them will begin to see that they ought to be reasonable.
*
I myself believe in protesting strongly, but without getting bogged down in so many details. Please let that remain as just my observation. Enough nasty things have been said in the comments, and I have no wish to add to them.
*
What I will state is this: Prof. Hoole has been unfairly treated on many issues. On the other hand, many of the things that he has said as an Elections Commissioner have done us ALL a great deal of good. Also, he is an honest man, and has never acted in such a way as to further his self-interest. Some have suggested that he did not pay traffic fines because he didn’t want to part with money etc. Having written that, I’ve checked. That was in another article – and I applaud what he said there.
The tone of all this is what is wrong. About religion, “Agnos” has some wise words. They appear way below this comment; I shall now gravitate that way!
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Naga / September 2, 2017
Ratnajeevan you are a disgrace to the whole Sri Lankan Tamil community. You are a self-seeker who wanted to become the Vice Chancellor and when that position was denied you turned spiteful against the Hindus who rightfully opposed the appointment of an anti-Hindu Christian zealot as the head of a secular educational institution.
Now you are spitting venom against CM Wigneswaran and MP Yogeswaran just because they are Hindu leaders.
You are even criticizing the leader of the Sri Lankan Catholic Church Cardinal Malcolm Ranjith because he did not condone the acts of fundamentalist Christian groups involved in religious conversion. It is a fact that Christian groups with funding from abroad are involved in converting Hindus to Christianity in Sri Lanka. Buddhists too are opposed to them because they are doing the same thing in the South. Not just in Sri Lanka but in Southern Indian states of Tamil Nadu and Kerala these Christian groups are involved in large scale religious conversions. Another country where I have personally seen this conversion happening is Cambodia. To the credit of Catholics of Sri Lanka, it must be recorded here that they are not involved in the religious conversion of Hindus or Buddhists into Christians.
Ratnajeevan you yourself comes from a family of converts. Your forefathers shamelessly converted from being Hindus to Christians for jobs and education. I can understand lower caste Hindus converting to Christianity because of the treatment they get from the high caste Hindus but your forefathers who were supposed to come from the high caste Vellalah Hindu community became Christians for no other reason but for the sake of jobs and education.
Ratnajeevan you are an insult to the Sri Lankan Tamils. Your education has not enlightened you and you remain a pathetic Christian zealot spiting venom against the Hindus.
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Tee Twenty / September 2, 2017
Naga: //… I can understand lower caste Hindus converting to Christianity because of the treatment they get from the high caste Hindus.. // Very Good — now forget about Hoole and tell us what you are doing about this i.e. treatment of lower caste Hindus by high cast ones. I thank you for acknowledging this, which is a good start!
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SJ / September 2, 2017
Naga
What makes you so sure that Hoole has been rejected by various people just because he antagonized a section of the Hindus?
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JU Observer / September 5, 2017
Read the article for what the arts faculty people wrote why Fr. Pilendran should not be elected
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SJ / September 5, 2017
I cannot comment on things that I have not seen. But that seems an opinion of an outsider.
Besides the false reporting of events by the author even in this text, one needs concrete evidence to establish a charge, not mere speculation.
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Mama Sinhalam / September 2, 2017
Hoole says of Wigneswaran : “The man cannot help himself”. Neither can Hoole.
Most people laugh off Wigneswaran’s allegiance to the rapist swami. It is his problem that for an ex-judge, he does not have sufficient discrimination. Rightly, even under BJP, swamis like Gurjeet Singh (and Premananda) are packed off to prison. Something, Sri Lanka has not done to Gnansara.
Chelvanayagam remains the most eminent leader of the Tamils. Most Tamils have not thought about what religion he belonged to and would not care. Even, Prabhakaran did not contest this.
About taking shoes off and vegetarianism, Hoole is magnifying events beyond the need. There is nothing Hindu about being vegetarian. There were carnivores among the 63 Tamil saints. When I was young and went to church for functions of my Christian relatives, all of us removed shoes ( incidentally, there were pews for different castes in churches).
It is okay to remove shoes. We still do when we go into houses. Very healthy habit. This man is a professional nit-picker. Like many of what Wigneswaran says about religion and caste, the pre-occupation of Hoole with caste and religion has to be taken with less than a pinch of salt. Why waste salt on Hoole?
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Raj / September 2, 2017
Man, how do I remove my feet to walk into my home after walking on the betel cud which is quickly swept into the sand by eekil broom carrying sweepers at the temple?
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Uthungan / September 2, 2017
Raj
If you had trampled betel cud or excreta on your shoes while walking on the street near the temple, do you walk into your house with it sticking to your shoes?
Ask Hoole he will reply!
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Sooriar / September 2, 2017
Did you read this article before saying “Chelvanayagam remains the most eminent leader of the Tamils. Most Tamils have not thought about what religion he belonged to and would not care.”
Yogeswaran says electing Christians is against the Navalar dream and this mistake was done before Wigneswaran was elected and rectified only with Wigneswaran’s election.Whose election do you think Yogeswaran was calling a mistake?
Wigneswaran had just finished his speech on Christians converting for money. Etc.
The Jaffna Hindu crowd was cheering. This is what the newspapers report and what Jaffna Hindus are brought up on.
Stop to think how Christians feel reading this. Please read carefully before letting your primitive genetic juices rush you into print.
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Mama Sinhalam / September 2, 2017
Maybe your primitive genetic juice maker was nicely caressed and shaped by foreign hands or its agents so that you had special dispensation to rush into print.
Jaffna Christianity is part of Jaffna culture. No Wigneswaran or Yogeswaran is going to change it. No Hoole, who has his own subjective agendas, needs to rescue it. It will survive as it should. The point that was made was that Chelvanayagam will continue to be accepted as our first leader and his religion does not come into the calculation at all.
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sach / September 3, 2017
Tamil is a part of Sri Lankan culture. No Sinhala leader is going to change it. No Sampanthan or Wigneshwaran who have their own subjective agendas need to rescue it. It will survive as it should. :)
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shankar / September 2, 2017
“Tamils have a just struggle for equality in Sri Lanka. Occasionally some Sinhalese admit that we have been wronged. I challenge the Hindus – is there anyone, even one, who would publicly say that we too are wronging our own minorities?”
if we are wronging our own people we have no justification to accuse the sinhalese of doing wrong things to us.physician heal thyself.Whether christian,hindu,vellala,non vellala,jaffna tamil,indian tamil,batti tamil,tamil speaking muslims all must be treated equally.After we have done that and satisfied ourselves that we are a non discriminatory race of people then we can take up the discriminatory practices of the sinhalese.
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NAK / September 2, 2017
Under occupation of western powers the situation was other way around. As the saying goes what goes around comes around.
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sach / September 2, 2017
Jaffna has a Hindu character. I dont know what is so wrong in acknowledging that!
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Anon / September 3, 2017
Sri Lanka has a Sinhala Buddhist culture, so acknowledge it
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Dr. Gnana Sankaralingam / September 4, 2017
First religion to be practiced in Srilanka is Saivaism and not Buddhism. Even Veddhas worshipped Murugan a Hindu God worshipped only by Tamils in India.
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V.J.Bose / September 2, 2017
I fully endorse the views of Prof. Hoole on Jaffna man’s attitude on religion and caste. A cultural revolution is the urgent need in the North – East before we think of liberation. In a village in Karaveddy, Kampollai, a cemetery is divided into 3 sections.one for the saiva vellalahs,one for the christian vellalahs and the other for the depressed castes.The first two are with the boundary walls. When someone volunteered to build boundary wall or the the third one, the local council is not granting permission. This is Jaffna man’s caste fanaticism in this modern world. Saiva siththandam and our ancient literature stress equality but not practised by the followers.Learn to treat others equal before expecting equality from others.
V.J.Bose
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SJ / September 2, 2017
The author himself has for a long time been notorious for his offensive remarks about Hinduism, and for some time about the Sinhala language among other things. There is little purpose in debating not very clever arguments.
To read Christian v. Hindu meanings into elections and selections is childish.
*
CVW, I suspect, is a victim of his beliefs, which are not always rational, and I have the sneaking suspicion that he would have thought that placing Premananda on par with Christ would make Christians more sympathetic to P.
*
Despite a century of struggle against caste oppression, Jaffna is still caste-ridden in many ways. The crematorium issue in Puththur area is a reminder. CVW was a little fairer than the other Tamil leaders on that issue, but lacked the courage of Sivajilingam to side with the protesting public.
There is Hindutva in Jaffna, but not a fraction as powerful in India. Like Indian mentors, the local followers are not just anti-Christian. Their is anti-Muslim, anti-Left, anti-reformist and many more things.
I am not convinced that there are organized attacks yet on Churches in the North.
There is resentment about Charismatic Christian and other Evangelical groups indulging in unethical conversions. Even Catholics and mainstream Protestant communities are targetted.
Like some critics of the Left still tarring all Left with the same brush as one would the opportunist Left, there are people who lump all Christians together in this business of conversion.
*
Finally, I would say that people who call for moderation and religious tolerance should also practice it.
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Charismatic / September 2, 2017
SJ you are part of the Jaggernaut through the Jaffna University establishment, in fact one of its wheels. What you did to Hoole’s appointment to Jaffna University diminishes you in the eyes of all decent people.
Now you pronounce judgement on Hoole. A twisted tongue is of no profit to the soul or society. Alas, a Ph. D does not make a man.
Unless God calls her/him one cannot follow Christ. Christ himself has said that. Why would one want to be a Christian in a place like Jaffna unless he is called?
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SJ / September 4, 2017
Charismatic
I am not judgmental on anyone.
I simply question claims that I feel are dubious.
I dislike to believe that you endorse practices like performing “miracles” in public meetings and bribing potential converts.
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Uthungan / September 2, 2017
The left is targeted for not supporting castism and for being secular and being immune to being burdened with religious attachments. But that is not due to ignorance, it is a middle class fashion that transcends any racial or religious barriers in the island.
All the so called religious believers in SL are on the same page when it comes to criticising downgrading and despising the left because that is the only isolated force that stands up for justice and justice and democracy.
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One Studying Sivasegaram / September 5, 2017
SJ is a full-time hate-mongering..
I see nothing in this article about Hinduism. But it is about how Hindus like SJ behave. Writing about discrimination by the Sinhalas is a quest for justice in SJ’ view.. But writing about discrimination by him and other Hindus, is against Hinduism and is hate-speech
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Jimsofty / September 2, 2017
Now only I understand the extent of christian influece in Yapanaya. Because, of th christian dominated media we do not get the correct picture. Other than that, problems in Myanmar, thailand, and many other countryes are relatd to christian influece and making problems among muslims and buddhists and using that inluence to convert and wreck societies. Hoole looks like a Christian Fanatics. CVW is a Hindu fanatic. IT is disgustinmg to see the way CVW works. This is why Buddhist monks have to follow what Buddha did and be Generous.
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Jimsofty / September 2, 2017
Hoole Talks about Tamil behaviour while blaming CVW. It is in newspapers how tamils catholic/christian Priests. during the LTTE times, one yapanaya university professor who also was a LTTE advisor had habitually raped his low caste sertvent girl. YOu people are stupid to accpet this low caste bullshit when you are supposed to be educated. why did you get a brain. Is it for thinking just vomitting racist, tribalist, anti-religious hatred. What is the intelligent behaviour of humans caleld HOme Sapirnes who are supposed to be intelligent. this is like one wants to promote his religion over the ther and he wants his way. So he is writing articles. Otherwise, Hoole always write articles about some hatred, it is against CVW who is a religious-fanatic, Tribalist, Casteist on his own way. Other times Holle comes and say he is above the sinhala people because he is Tamil and then he phone Mahinda Deshapriya. Why don’t you all go to south indiand live your lives ?—————- IT is pathetic so called political power CVW and educated Tamil christins promote hatred against so-called low castes where should those people go in order to live. Why buddhist organizations in the south do not help these stranded people ?. there is a case of a school girl gang raped and killed helped by more than one politicians with the help of Sinhala police who are equally corrupt. Why the world is different for that girl, and these barbarians talk about his religon note being at the forfront, he notgetting his own way. I think electrical engeering PhDs should very dumb in order to this guy getting a DSc in the same subject I suppose.
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spartacusthasan / September 2, 2017
a bias and stereotypical assessment. the Hools are well known christian fundamentalists ?
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Agnos / September 2, 2017
Dr. Hoole,
I have just read an article in The Washington Post, by one Gary Abernathy, about why most evangelicals don’t condemn Trump. The arguments advanced by evangelicals in support of Trump are some of the worst kind of sophistries I have seen in my life.
The truth is that all religions are founded on falsehoods and sophistries; all scriptures are full of internal contradictions that render them complete fiction. Hinduism and Christianity are no exceptions.
Your arguments against religious discrimination are tantamount to your saying that you can somehow find a portion of good milk to drink from a poisoned glass of milk. What is required is to throw out the whole of it and find fresh milk.
The answer is to throw out all religions and cultivate agnosticism, and if necessary, a general sense of spirituality. In practical terms, that requires advocating secularism while keeping one’s beliefs private. That applies equally to CVW, the Batti MP and you.
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Sinhala_Man / September 5, 2017
Dear Agnos,
I think your comment a most sensible one. These religions have been around for a long time, and the ALL seem to profess that they have a monopoly of the truth. I’d say that some religions DO appear to me to be worse than others in certain respects – but I’m not going to talk about those religions where my knowledge is far too little.
I DO know the Anglican Church, and I find it manipulative in the extreme. With only 24,000 members they ought to ask themselves why they are now in this predicament. I have tried to meet Bishop Dhiloraj Canagasabey to discuss these matters with him. Met him, I have on many occasions, but it has never got beyond a shaking hands. He NEVER has time for me. It is for him to explain himself; I cannot.
I wholeheartedly agree with you that roughly 2018 years after the birth of Christ [actually most serious Biblical Scholars hold that Jesus was born in 4 B.C.; it is a minor point meant only to indicate that I’m not totally ignorant! ], any public manifestation of religion ought to have a healthy dose of “agnosticism” in it. Unfortunately this sort of religion will claim few adherents; study, if any readers have the time, how this group conducts itself:
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Quakers
Only 10 in certain countries; but they are not really losing sleep over that! Well, I have attended quite a few of their meetings – and sometimes fallen asleep! No prayers, no hymns, no clergy. Most importantly no creed to assure you of eternal bliss in heaven.
No more shall I say, unless someone decides to attack me (probably on the grounds that I’m cowardly!)
Yes, to secularism in public life!
/
K.Pillai / September 2, 2017
Ostensibly the meeting was “Dedicated to the Memory and Heritage of the Democrat, Peace-maker, Tamil Leader, and Martyr to the Tamil Cause, Appapillai Amirthalingam……”.
In the speech there is very little Amirthalingam. Who organised it? By the Hoole gang? Why? To create a venue for the gang leader to deliver the speech!
By the way the “speech” was carried in CT on 02 September but the actual event was on 03 September. Clumsy clumsy clumsy gang! Was Sampanthar present? Did he say anything about Wignes? Who the hell is this special guest Attorney Kanaha Manoharan of Canada?
RSH Hoole is trying to create the impression that hatred pervades between Christians and Hindus. There is no warlike atmosphere – not even digging the heels in”. Certainly no spitting.
Hoole adds this caste system in. This is music to certain southern politicians.
RSH H goes hammer and tongs against the CM NPC Wigneswaran. The CM may be wrong in deifying a godman.
Do you agree that ALL godpersons are fake? Why not campaign on this fundamental issue?
Hoole is on EC but Jaffna University refused to have him. JC saw through his shallow intellect!
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Uthungan / September 3, 2017
Kanaha Manoharan is an opportunistic wind bag from Canada and was a loyal unquestioning Amirthalingam side kick.
Whenever or wherever he is given an opportunity he comes out with bombasticran rants. Trump should include him in his right wing fascist team.
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Anon / September 3, 2017
When do you Tamil guys ever like anyone?
/
Visakaran / September 6, 2017
Kanaganathan Manoharan released his book yesterday, Tuesday. He takes apart the LTTE crowd that still adores Prabakaran. No wonder that Uthungan hates Manoharan so much.
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soma / September 3, 2017
In India Christians are categorised as falling into ‘scheduled caste’. Are the Christian Tamils too in Jaffna considered low caste’? Though I have read contradictory accounts many Sinhalese believe that Prabhakaran was a Christian and it is the Tamil Christians who spearheaded the war, Hindus being non violent would not let their children engage in that unconciable terrorism. Tamil Christians must have been entertaning the notion that they are double discriminated.
Soma
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Real Siva Sankaran Sharma / September 3, 2017
99% of the Indian Christians other than the Syrian or Nasrani Christians of Kerala and many Goan Catholics who belong to all castes from Brahmin to Dalit, due to forced conversions, are Dalits. You do get Christians from the upper caste families but they are a small minority. The general impression other than in Kerala or Goa , is that if you are Christian, your ancestors were from the sheduled castes. Even in Kerala the Nasrani Mappilas or Syrian Christians look down on the Catholic and other Christians, as unlike them, they do not have an ancient history and are largely converted from the lower castes, whereas the Syrian Christians are largely descended from the upper castes ( Namboothiri Brahmins and Nairs) , ancient Jewish immigrants and Syrian Arab Christian traders. The Kannaniya Nasranis are descended from Jewish converts to Christianity. and generally they only tend to marry amongst themselves and have customs , that are peculiar to them. Jews Arabs and many others settled in the ancient Tamil Chera country now modern day Kerala. .However in Sri Lanka most Catholics be they Sinhalese or Tamil are largely descended from Karawa.Karaiyar caste, which is lower but still not a scheduled or low caste. The Protestant Christians are largely from the
powerful Govigamma/Vellalar caste, there may be a few low caste converts , however unlike most of India Christianity was largely embraced by the middle and upper caste Sinhalese and Tamils, This is why there is no stigma and they are not look down upon and many of the Protestant Christian both among the Sinhalese and Sri Lankan Tamils belong to powerful Tamils. However it is the opposite among the Indian origin estate Tamil Christians. This is why the largely upper caste Sri Lankan Tamil Christians consider them as low caste outsiders and discourage any sort of marriage into them
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soma / September 3, 2017
Thank you RSSS.
Soma
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SJ / September 4, 2017
You seem to have strange strong views about caste hierarchy.
Can you explain why is the Brahmin placed well below the wealthy Vellala in Jaffna society? Many a Jaffna Vellala subscribes to this state of affairs; and it has been referred to by several writers including Daniel and Theniyan.
*
Is it not time that South Asians become more civilized and be rid of cate identity?
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Real Siva Sankaran Sharma / September 5, 2017
Please do not assume what I think or my views. I am answering to Soma regarding the origin of most Indian and Sri Lankan Christians , as to why most Sri Lankan Christians are not looked down or considered to belong to the scheduled castes and whereas Indian Christians are, other than in Kerala and Goa, as the history and origin of the Christians in these two states are different from the rest of India. Then again you have a special grudge against me as well as most other Tamils in this forum ,as you are an apologist to Sinhalese racism. Brahmins in Jaffna are still ritualistically considered higher than the Vellala , however is social status they are lower, as unlike in India or even Tamil Nadu , their numbers are small and they area the paid employees of Vellalars who own and run the temples. In Tamil Nadu and in many other parts of Indian . The kings granted thousands of acres of land to the temples and the Brahmins managed them . This is the major difference. Historically unlike India, the Sri Lankan Tamils never came under the Brahminical influence , until the Cholas started to import Brahmins from India around the 12Th century to administer the agamic temples. There may have been a few before this era. but very few
/
SJ / September 5, 2017
Whether you respond to Soma or any other, your obsession with caste raises its head almost everywhere.
The Brahmin is social placed very low although in the temple people respect him the way the Sinhalese treat the Buddhist clergy.
Daniel and Theniyan were very sympathetic to Jaffna Brahmins, because they could see that they were oppressed by the Vellala.
In Tamilnadu Rajaraja granted land in scertain parts of Tamilnadu.
In Bengal the Kayastha dominate over the Brahmin. In Nepal the only Hindu state, the Chaitri rule the roost.
*
The point is that socio-economic factors decide the caste hierarchy.
Besides, how sure can be an individual of his/her true ancestry?
*
Kindly stop insulting people by caste identity.
/
Real Siva Sankaran Sharma / September 5, 2017
Revealing the true identity and origins of fake Aryans and Arabs/Moors , who in the name of these fake identities and origins , try to act superior and commit discrimination genocide and war cirmes is not an insult. That you find this sort of behaviour repulsive and offensive and keep on condoning it, for reasons known to you and your own personal agenda, and then attack the messenger , reveals more about you than me. You really as a ” Slime Jar” as many people in this forum call you.
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SJ / September 7, 2017
“as many people in this forum”
Learn to count for a start.
*
To what class does your racist hate text belong?
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One Studying Sivasegaram / September 6, 2017
Sivasegaram has claimed to be high Vellalar related to Vanniasingam and in that capacity higher than Brahmins. Than he wants us not to insult people by caste identity. Not very bright for a professor.
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SJ / September 7, 2017
O-S-S
How exactly did Sivasegaram make such claims?
He laughs at all caste and other identity based assertions to greatness.
*
It could hurt some very badly, especially if they make a habit of personally insulting anyone who does not fit into their petty schemes..
Truly sorry if it includes you.
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LC / September 8, 2017
Here Sivasegaram (SJ) says vellalar are higher than Brahmins. In a comment on a previous article he claimed to be related to Vanniasingam, a man beloinging to the well known high caste karkattu vellala Saiva clan from Maviddapuram.
It is typical. These fellows say they are against caste and then indirectly make it a point to tell us their caste by saying who their relations are.
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Sinhala_Man / September 9, 2017
LC,
Most perceptive of you!
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SJ / September 10, 2017
What perception, may I know?
SM, please check your facts before you make flippant pronouncements.
*
RSS keeps insulting many people by caste and uses his caste identity to call all manner of people low caste.
It was in that context that I pointed out that the caste hierarchy in reality is dictated by the socio-economic order and not some ancient declaration.
*
The point that I made long ago was that very nearly everyone in Jaffna claims relationship to everyone else unless there is a caste factor involved. Many a bogus claim is made about ancestors too.
*
Marxists are acutely aware of that reality that caste exists and caste identity will survive for long in any South Asian society influenced by feudal ideology.
What Marxists did was to fight discrimination and oppression by caste. They earned the wrath of much of the “upper caste”. No Tamil nationalist party– neither the more conservative Tamil Congress tradition nor the seemingly liberal FP tradition –dared to challenge caste oppression. Caste discrimination continues– more in subtler ways –and it is still the left that is drawing attention to it.
*
The Sinhalese mainstream society is free of the curse of untouchability (except for the Rodia being an outcast community) and a Sinhalese finds it hard to understand the frame of mind of the caste-conscious Jaffna Tamil. So do many Tamils outside the peninsula.
Also, I should warn you that it is not purely a Tamil Hindu phenomenon.
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SJ / September 4, 2017
Soma
Mostly, people converted for personal/social advancement. There were, however, instances where there was intellectual or emotive reason for conversion.
(I had it from a close relative of KW Devanayagam that he converted while at St Joseph’s to ensure a place in a sports team. Pretty sound reason I will say.)
*
Catholics converted mostly during Portuguese occupation. They suffered under the Dutch; but that made them firm in their faith.
Conversion to Protestant Christianity involved a wide range of castes, but the ‘upper layers’ were more in number. There have been several converts who reconverted to Hinduism after they received their education or other benefits.
*
Buddhism attracted the untouchables all across India, as it did widows and other oppressed layers. there was no attempt to convert, people desperately seeking liberation were attracted to it.
*
A passive religion is no guarantee of peaceful personal conduct.
Look at the way the Hinduta thugs behave in India and Buddhist gangs behave in Burma, and let us not forget the Aluthgama incident of not long ago.
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Real Siva Sankaran Sharma / September 3, 2017
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ctrLK_iyQmE
A traditional Syriyan Christian wedding in Kerala . You can see it a mixture of ancient Hindu customs plus eastern orthodox and Jewish customs. The Bride wears red like a traditional Hindu bride instead of white to church. Many of these ancient customs may now be discarded but was very common in the 1980s and before. Thier culture is very Hindu and eastern Christian
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Mathusoothananj / September 3, 2017
Hoole is the racist here he can’t stand Hindus or Buddhists worship.
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Maya / September 4, 2017
Amirthalingam’s son Dr Bakirathan and his friend Gowrikanthan have assaulted Paramesvaran, a journalist from Jaffna , at the meeting held in remembarance of late A Amirthalingam today, for distributing a leaflet accusing Amirthalingam and other Federal Party members for not opposing the PTA introduced by JR in 1979.
We will wait and see how Police will react on Paramesvaran’s complaint.
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Dr. Gnana Sankaralingam / September 4, 2017
Thanks for that information. Amirthalingam was very arrogant thinking that he knows everything and all what he is doing should not be questioned. Now his son is showing that nature by his conduct. I have no doubt about ability of Amirthalingam, but he got cold feet about struggle for justice when JR threatened him of putting him in jail if he embarks on any campaign, but promised him that he will settle Tamil problem. Like Sambanthan having faith on Chandrika/Ranil to settle the problem, he also believed JR. This may be the reason that he did not oppose PTA introduced by JR. I am really angry with Amirthalingam for a lapse he made. In 1983, prior to the riots, I was warned by good Sinhalese that a major riot is going to take place against Tamils. I brought this to the notice of Amirthalingam to mention it in Parliament. But he casually dismissed it saying that he cannot say anything in Parliament on a hearsay basis without concrete evidence and also that he is confident that JR will never allow such thing to happen. Rest is history and if Amirthalingam had acted with responsibility with this pre-emptive strike on the planners of the riot, several lives and properties of Tamils would not have been lost.
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Tee Twenty / September 4, 2017
//In 1983, prior to the riots, I was warned by good Sinhalese that a major riot is going to take place against Tamils.// How did your “good Sinhalese” know this? And why do you claim Amirthalingam should have believed you? Between 1956 and 1983, any day would have been good for any fool to make a prediction that Tamils were going to be beaten up the next day. Some of these predictions we know came to be true, others not.
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The Voice of Caution / September 4, 2017
Amirthalingam just could not have made a speech in Parliament without concrete proof
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Dr. Gnana Sankaralingam / September 5, 2017
Please do not jump to conclusions without knowing the facts. By that time parts of Srilanka was burning, a Tamil RMP was killed in Ratmalana, properties were torched in Trincomalee and Kurunegala. All these were going on without any action by the government to stop them and bring the perpetrators to book. Were these not enough for anyone with iota of intelligence that this is going to continue. Those who were not living in Sinhala parts of Srilanka should not comment on the riots that took place. We were eye witnesses to those incident. 1983 riots was well planned and executed and the killing of 13 soldiers were an excuse to carry it out. Even on the Monday morning had the government took action to declare curfew and impose martial law, most of the death and destruction could have been avoided. But JR did not do it as the intention of the government was to destroy Tamils economically.
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Sinhala_Man / September 6, 2017
To me, it was obvious by mid-1982, that we were heading for communal violence.
Clear and direct experience of it began on the 11th May 1983, and guys like me began to do what we could as soon as we got to know on the 12th of May. We were in no doubt as to what we were facing, but knew that while we could mitigate some of the effects, this violence was too pervasive and well-planned for us to really stop it.
https://www.colombotelegraph.com/index.php/university-of-peradeniya-may-1983-when-majesty-stoops-to-folly/
It could have been nipped in the bud by J.R. Jayawardena, but then we then felt (and are certain now) that Cyril Mathew had his blessings.
I just don’t know how much Amirthalingam could have done. He certainly wasn’t in control of events.
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SJ / September 4, 2017
Maya
I am no admirer of AA. But I will not go to the extent of insulting the man at a meeting held in his memory. There are plenty of other fora to express critical views on AA.
Did Parameswaran attend the meeting as a Journalist? If so it, was improper to indulge in distributing pamphlets.
Yet, I agree that it is unacceptable to assault anyone for unethical conduct.
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Attendee / September 4, 2017
Today’s Thinakkural reported that Parameswaran asked some questions and was taken out of the hall and assaulted. This is false.
I was there. Parameswaran came with some copies of a sheet alleging that Amirthalingam voted for the PTA. He asked no question as the speeches we’re still on. There was no question time either.
Parameswaran had just begun his distribution. The first sheets were given to CVK Sivagnanam and 2 others. By then Dr. Bageerathan snatched the sheets away from Prameswaran. Baheerathan’s cousin joined Baheerathan saying, however many times we tell you not to, you come with these notices. The two took Parameswaran by the arm and and led him out with the sheets and returned to the meeting. The three who received the sheets put the sheets on a vacant seat.
Very definitely Parameswaran did not ask any question. That he was assaulted is his allegation. The Thinakkural account seems to have been type-set ahead of the meeting, thinking that Parameswaran would get the opportunity to shout his question, expecting him to be assaulted.
Maya should have asked Dr. Baheerathan for his side of the story. That is good journalism.
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Jimsofty / September 5, 2017
Holding by hand is assult charges. that is equal to assault.
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Plato. / September 4, 2017
Had someone else other than Amirthalingam taken over the Leadership of the TULF/FP in the post SJVChelvanayagam period the relationships of the Sinhala-Tamil people would have been far more cordial. Amir was a curse! bestowed on the Tamils.One has to only read the Hansard from 1956 onwards to see how he took the Tamils to a point of no return. My view is that he had no temperament whatsoever to take on the Leadership! Amir believed in confrontational politics,WHICH EVENTUALLY led to an Armed conflict,and at what cost? Lets be frank and search our souls; And at the end of the day Mrs.A.BUILDS HOUSES for those who killed the killers!
Mrs.A.was the daughter of a Jaffna green grocer who set up business at Welimada!
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Tee Twenty / September 5, 2017
Precisely, Plato. Apart from the last sentence (we don’t really care what her father did for a living) I fully agree with the assessment.
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John / September 5, 2017
There is no attack on any Christian church in Sri Lanka. So called Christians who have claimed that their places of worship have been attacked are not TRUE Christians, they haven’t read the Bible or don’t know what’s in the Bible. They’ve become Christians for NGO money.
–
Cardinal Malcolm Ranjith is absolutely right.
Dias was lying on TV, his documents are meant to make some money for him, he fled the country in case of a violent public reaction for his lies.
–
These pretentious NGO- Christians who haven’t read the Bible are a threat to real Christian churches (Catholic, Baptists, Methodist, etc), Christians and general public, they go from house to house, force people to convert to their version of Christianity, access naive and gullible followers’ (victims’) bank accounts and take their savings, demand their houses as places of worship which angers the neighbors. And these crook NGO Christian predators prey on people who have so many problem in their lives.
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Pygmalion / September 5, 2017
SJ.
I need to correct your line Re: K.W.Devanayagam. He was born a Christian and Baptised as well[William]. His mother was a devout Christian and hailed from Jaffna whilst his father was from Batticaloa and a Hindu who converted to Christianity shortly after marriage.In fact,he told me once that he came under the influence of the Jesuit Priests whilst at SJC when he was very young long before being Captain of Cricket,Tennis and Football! He remained a Catholic true to his conviction right upto the time of his death @ 96years of age.His first wife the first Ceylonese Lady Lawyer remained a Buddhist right upto her death. A UNPer right thru to his last days.
Though he always wore a Full-Suit,not having recourse to occasionally wear the National dress,for pretentious purposes,he was anything but a Turn-Coat!
/
One Studying Sivasegaram / September 5, 2017
Sivasegaram badly caught spreading hatred against Christians!
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SJ / September 7, 2017
O-S-S
Nice try, but not clever enough.
Better luck next time .
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SJ / September 7, 2017
Dear Pygs
I remember your narrating the conversion long ago and took for granted that he was Hindu. I remember sports coming into the story. So I remembered it the way I narrated.
I stand corrected.
*
The point is that he converted for a far more interesting reason than most others .
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One Studying Sivasegaram / September 8, 2017
SJ,
Stop bluffing. Devanayagam as Pyg. says was born a Christian to Christian parents.
You lied about Devanayagam, were caught at it and as always try to bluff your way out with another yarn.
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SJ / September 10, 2017
Bluffing is your specialization.
Pygmalion said he was born to a Christian mother and a father who converted after marriage. He clarified that the conversion was from (protestant) Christianity to Roman Catholicism.
I am sure you know the difference between the two faiths.
Do not let your desperation get the better of sense.
/
V. S. Subramaniam / September 8, 2017
Give up SJ. Please!
You lied about Hon. Devanayagm. Now you say you remember Pygmalion’s narration. Why then did you say he converted?
I have lost all faith in you. You sounded so objective in previous comments but it seems to be a cover only to camouflage your hate for our minorities and make your slanders about them seem objective.
Please go away. Let us hear some sensible people in this forum.
/
Poor from North / September 5, 2017
World vision and Habitat are well known for converting war affected poor people to christianity through providing them various assistance. Thousands of Hindus have already been converted in North, East and up country. We cannot blame these organisations and other evangelicals because proselytization is in their blood and no assistance is given by them free. It is their way of deceiving the poor. What surprise us is European Union has given millions of dollars to these two organisations recently to build houses and help in the livelihood of the war victims living in the north and eastern provinces , in spite of knowing the ulterior motive of these organisations. Are we to assume that European Union has become the headquarters of proselytisation? .Hallelujah !!
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Staff / September 6, 2017
World vision is a neutral organization, though faith-based. Aid is not provided on the basis of caste or creed. There are no ulterior motives as you claim. But where people do good work in dire times, perhaps others are naturally drawn to their faith
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Maya / September 5, 2017
Attendee
I am not in Jaffna and you were there at the meeting. Once the meeting was over you would have definitely heard from the people attended the meeting what had happened outside the hall. Or you could have easily found out from Dr Baheerathan
or his cousin instead of asking me. I am sure they will not accept if any assault took place but the police enquiry will reveal the truth and we will wait for it.
While I do condemn the distribution of leaflet inside the hall, I equally condemn the violent behaviour of anyone.
Out of curiosity I wish to know what did Baheerathan speak to Mahinda Rajapakse when he met in Colombo few years back and what did his mother speak when she met Mahinda in London srilankan embassy.
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SJ / September 7, 2017
Maya
The issues raised by you are not quite pertinent to the subject at hand, namely an assault.
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Daniston / September 8, 2017
This is regarding SJ/Sivasegaram’s comment above on KW Devanayagam: “I had it from a close relative of KW Devanayagam that he converted while at St Joseph’s to ensure a place in a sports team. Pretty sound reason I will say.”
When challenged by Pygmalion who pointed out that Devanayagam was born to Christian parents and was baptised a Christian, Prof. Sivasegaram waffles but still persists in his hate-narration, saying “The point is that he converted for a far more interesting reason than most others.”
No he did not convert at all.
I spoke to Father Joe Mary, an established Jesuit Priest among us here in Batticaloa. He confirms what Pygmalion says.
Adds Father Joe of Sivasegaram, “What a terrible lie. Absurd..” He expressed surprise that such a man could be a Senior Professor when he admits to his mistake when it was pointed out by Pygmalion and then repeats it. Such is his dishonest sophistry.
Father Joe spoke of the Crowthers, Devanayagams and other great Christians from Batticalao and regretted that their names are unnecessarily sullied by Sivasegaram.
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One Studying Sivasegaram / September 9, 2017
Oh my! The man has been walking around with his pants down and does not even know it.
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SJ / September 9, 2017
Daniston
Pygmalion (Pygmalion in fact a very close relative of KWD) told me about conversion and that is confirmed by him:
“His mother was a devout Christian and hailed from Jaffna whilst his father was from Batticaloa and a Hindu who converted to Christianity shortly after marriage. In fact,he told me once that he came under the influence of the Jesuit Priests whilst at SJC when he was very young…”
So there was conversion of KWD.
*
Pygmalion gave me the impression that was for sport, and to me that was an interesting an not an objectionable reason.
I accepted the correction by Pygmalion, which was about the reason for conversion not the conversion itself.
*
I did not repeat any error, but only said: “The point is that he converted for a far more interesting reason than most others .”
The reason being coming under the influence of the Jesuit Priests, to me is more intellectual than that for the conversion of many others.
Kindly read carefully before jumping to conclusions.
*
O-S-S
Knowing whose alias you are, all I can say is “You really are pathetic”.
/
Catholic / September 10, 2017
A baptised Catholic coming under the influence of the Jesuits (who are Catholics) is not a conversion. It is time for Prof. Sivasegarm to stop insisting that KWDevanayagam converted.
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Pygmalion / September 10, 2017
SJ.
With no malice to you; Whilst we are on the subject of KWD, I do not wish to miss this opportunity of highlighting this gross injustice,particularly so in view of the fact that you are essentially a University man.,both in this country and @ Imperial College UK.
sj,as you know only too well the FOUNDER of the Eastern University was KWD. I knew the great effort that he had put in when he was a Minister to persuade the Govt: of the day to establish the Eastern University; Prof: Stanley Kalpage says so in his book; But,alas KWD was honoured with an Honoris Causa more than 10years after his death!
In the meantime,Tamil poets,Surveyor Generals and other inconsequential folks were honoured on a yearly basis!
INGRATITUDE was taken to a new dimension.
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SJ / September 10, 2017
Pygs
Thanks.
The hot air provoked by intentional distortion of your words, kept alive this string which otherwise may have terminated days ago and denied you the chance to make this useful comment.
*
I was critical of UNP politics all along and no friend of Tamil nationalists. I was not a supporter of the UF either. You know well that my views on parties and personalities have been policy based.
Nor was I part of the clash between the FP/TUF and those whom they branded as traitors for being with the UNP or the SLFP.
*
I know some of the members of the EUSL in its founding decade. They have told me of the role played by KWD. But the political map had changed rapidly.
I was not around after 1983, but was sad to hear much later that academics were producing anti-Jaffna posters to ensure that a ‘son-of-the-soil’ is Vice Chancellor.
The EU got terribly politicized in a most negative way. My hope is the the new VC will be allowed to do something useful.
Honorary degrees in many universities are political of some kind. Peradeniya mostly honours academics. I expressed reservations about a few awards because I saw other motives.
Peradeniya & Colombo are less vulnerable to popular politics, but could be subject to pressure from those in power, but not a lot in honorary degrees.
*
While it is a good thong that KWD’s role has at last been appreciated, sadly, there is little to take pride in being one among the less deserving.
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SJ / September 10, 2017
Catholic
He was born a Christian (not Catholic) and Baptised as well.
He came under the influence of the Jesuit Priests whilst at SJC when he was very young.
Will its being his own decision or his drifting into Catholicism mean that there was no change in faith (meaning conversion)?
If you think so, so be it.
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I was wrong about the reason I gave for the change in faith. But that was how I understood Pygmalion when he casually narrated the story several years ago, and I promptly accepted his word when he corrected me.
I am no advocate of any faith and do not care very much about anyone changing his/her faith; and if anyone has an issue with conversion, that is their problem, not mine.
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VSS
A lie is intentional.
Choose your words with care.
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Rev. Fr. Charles P. / September 10, 2017
Professor Sivasegaram,
I took you to be stubborn and a deliberate liar and slanderer.
However, I thank God that to your advantage, you now come out as ignorant rather than as an evil religious partisan.
You say of Mr. Devanayagam “He was born a Christian (not Catholic) and Baptised as well.”
Catholics, you obviously do not know, form the largest denomination of Christianity. Are you saying we are not Christians?
I will not debate this but our theology also lays claim to being the only legitimate church, the Bride of Christ. We are the catholic and apostolic Church founded by Christ. (Admittedly other Christians contest this claim). The word catholic means universal. We represent Christianity world wide.
We also baptise our infants and like all Christians insist on baptism as necessary for our salvation..Are you denying this?
You are now insulting us Catholics by saying we are not Christians and implying that we do not go through the salvific rite of baptism, one of our seven sacraments..
You are opening a can of worms and treading on a religious minefield. Please desist.
Please do not write on subjects you do not know.Indeed, you do not have to comment on every article when it is outside your realm of knowledge..
God bless you.
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SJ / September 10, 2017
Dear Rev Charles
Sorry to disappoint you by pointing out that I happen know a little more about Christian faiths than you would concede.
I am also aware of the sharp differences in belief between the Roman Catholic Church and various Protestant Churches, despite sincere efforts to patch up.
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Rival Christian faiths (especially RC and any Protestant faith) are for practical purposes different religions and recognized as such globally. The divide is very deep in some countries/regions (like in Northern Ireland and in Ceylon under Dutch rule)
A change from one to the other is not a simple process and, notably, the term ‘conversion’ is used commonly to refer to such change of belief (if not faith) as in the heading on a Christian website: (http://www.christianitytoday.com/news/2014/november/sorry-pope-francis-protestants-catholics-latin-america-pew.html):
Protestants Are Converting Catholics Across Latin America
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If you think differently, and are offended by what I said I express my sincere regrets, as I did not mean to offend any.
You will agree I hope that, rightly or wrongly, the term Christian is commonly used in this country to refer to Protestants and the term Catholic is used to refer to Roman Catholics, although all are Christians. Nobody has called it an insult as far as I know.
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This thread started with my saying the KDW converted to Catholicism. I erred seriously in the reason for his change of faith.
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Can I assume that this still a free country and one has the sacred right to be wrong.
Kindly note that I am not Professor anybody.
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The Rev. Fr. Charles P. / September 11, 2017
Sir,
You implied that we Catholics are not Christians. That is offensive. Let us not hide behind the “commonly used” mistaken .terms in this country.
Yes. Sadly many things divide Christendom. But a lot more binds us together if you follow the ecumenical dialog between the Holy Father and the Heads of other Churches
Please do not ever again deny Catholics the Christian label. It is perhaps a clumsy way to insult Catholics and I sense stubborn persistence in you.
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Vannarpannai Methodist / September 10, 2017
Royal College was founded as a secular College by Christian priests, Hartley, Harvard, Marsh and Boak so that all denominations of Christians and boys of other religions could study there. They were enabled for very good leadership.
Alas, CVW’s education at Royal was wasted. His approach is antithetical to our College’s mission and harmful to a multicultural society in the North and East..Hindu fundamentalism is a big problem in Jaffna lead by CVW and Jaffna University council members whose biggest qualification is some affiliation to some unknown temple. So uneducated to determine our destiny.
So with Prof. Sivasegaram/SJ. Neither has the polish of an enlightened person. Alas, the intellectual degradation of the Tamills is being accelerated by these two Royalists, one as CM and the other as a P.rofessor and council member of the Jaffna University.. CVW does not have it in him to lead us. They are playing to the gallery and we in the North and East are drowning in our problems. No wonder more than 500 people in Jaffna are attempting suicide each year
The most progress for the Ceylon Tamils ever, took place during the 200 years when the Christian missionaries were with us. In every sphere we leap-frogged. Modern principles of governance are based on enlightened principles which these two persons are utterly ignorant of though they want to lead us.
To go back to the puranic principles in governing a community at such great risk is to commit self-genocide.
We Tamils must remove CVW as CM for our own survival and SJ to maintain our sanity.
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SJ / September 10, 2017
Vannarpannai
It is Harward not Harvard and Boake not Boak.
Those are the least serious of your mistakes.
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Pygmalion / September 10, 2017
SJ.
I am sorry that this controversy about what I told you many years ago,perhaps in 1977, has provoked so much hot air!
But your last line…………..there is little to take pride in being one among the less deserving says it all.
Thanks SJ.
So what this means is that KWD is the Pearl amongst the Swines!
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