23 September, 2017

The Vanniyas Of Sri Lanka Vs Vanniyas Of South India

By Darshanie Ratnawalli

 Darshanie Ratnawalli

Darshanie Ratnawalli

I got a query from Tissa Devendra regarding my previous piece, Memories of the Vanni, Vaddas and Vanniyas. “Do you mean to say that the Vanni was peopled by a slow influx of Vanniyar caste infiltrators from South India?” he asked. I told him that it’s simplistic to imagine Sri Lanka as a setting where South Indian concepts and conditions get duplicated en mass as if traced by carbon paper. There were in-migrations orchestrated by the medieval central Sinhala states that claimed suzerainty or chakravarthihood over the whole country[i]. But these migrations were from diverse milieus in South India and also Bengal. The key word is “diverse cultural milieus” of South India.

None of the immigrant groups from South India given in the Sinhalese folk historical tradition as appointees to chieftaincies in the Wanni of Lanka can be identified as belonging to the group called Vanniyar mentioned in South Indian records from the 10th/11th century onwards[ii]. The Malavaras, lovingly mentioned in the relevant Hugh Nevill manuscript (Or 6606-182)[iii] as “the first possessors of the very own Wanni kingdom belonging to this Lanka”, are not of South Indian Vanniyar stock. Instead they are “chiefs of certain hill-tribes in the Karnata and Tamil areas of South India” whose warlike habits secured them many mentions in “the Pandya records of the thirteenth century in South India”( Indrapala 1965 thesis p296). The Malavara chieftains are also listed in the Sri Lankan Tamil tradition (in the “Vaiyapatal” and the “Vaiya”) among the more important colonists of Jaffna-(ibid).

Nieuwe Kaart Van Het Eyland Ceylon, Francoise Valentyn, J. van Braam et G.onder.de Linden” (1724-1726)Nor do the chieftains of Ariya Vamsa who are immortalized in the Vanni Puvata (Or 6606-139) as having received lands in the Puttalama, Munnessara, Jaffna, and a number of villages in Nuvarakalaviya(D.G.B 1996[iv])  seem to be of the Vanniyar kula of South India. Ariya Vamsa is not an appellation carrying associations with the Vanniyar group of South India.

Another group, which stands outside of the Vanniyar of South India, but became Vanniyas of Lanka were the Mukkuvas. A copperplate grant of Bhuvanekabahu VII in Sinhalese dated to 1544 A.D refers to a Navaratna Vanniya of Lunuvila, a mukkuva chieftain of the Puttalam region (Indrapala 1970: S. Casie Chetty, Ceylon Gazetteer, 1834, p190-191).

And yet the connection seems undeniable. It can’t be co-incidence which gave Vanniyas, Vannivaru, Wannins, the Wanniya (closed vowel), and Wanniyalettho to Sri Lanka and Vanniyars, Vanniya-ma-devans, Vanniya-perumals, Vanniya-nayans (lord of the Vanniya), Vanniyapparrus (Vanniya holding) and Vanno samantha bhumipo (a Vanni ruler) to South India[v]. At the same time, the differences of context between the vanniyas of the two regions also seem undeniable. The Vanniyas of South India lack a Wanni. They are like cowboys in a country without cows. South India (unlike Sri Lanka) does not have an easily understood, almost colloquial term in a local language; “wanniya” (closed vowel) denoting a forested geography in which “wanantharaya” (jungle) is implicit, ingrained and irretrievably welded. So much is this lack that the South Indian tradition has to painstakingly derive the word “vanni” from “vahni” (fire).

According to the South Indian “Tamil work Cilai-elupattu, probably composed in the period of the Vijayanagar empire (14th-16th century)” the Vanniyar “belonged to the Agni kula”- (Indrapala 1970). “This association with the Agni-kula (fire –family or caste), in S. Gnanapragasar’s opinion, is a theory born of the similarity between vahni (fire) and vanni. In fact there is a legend among the Vanniyar caste of North Arcot (Tamilnadu State) which illustrates the derivation of their name from vahni.”- (ibid) “Thus we find in the literature and tradition of South India the origin of the Vanniyar being associated with fire or the Agni-kula. The derivation of their name from vahni, therefore seems to be plausible but is not very convincing. As Gnanapragasar has suggested, this association may represent a later attempt to derive the name from vahni. Even if we allow the association with the Agni-kula as plausible, it is difficult to explain why their name was derived from a rarer word like vahni instead of the more common agni”.-(ibid)

Another contextual difference is that in South India the Vanniyar are only a tribe, group or a clan, while in Sri Lanka Vanniya becomes an administrative office/title under which diverse lineages were encompassed. In Sri Lanka too the Vanniyas became a caste, but only later due to the occupational reason of having held vanniyaships in the wanni of Lanka.

Perhaps the single most unexplained jarring note in the conceptual link between the Vanniyas of South India and Sri Lanka is provided by the Vaddas who inconveniently bear the name wanniyalettho. Perhaps they offer the most compelling reason to conclude that Wanniya (closed vowel) is an indigenous concept which stretched to embrace and perhaps name the chieftaincies that sprang up to rule it. And yet perhaps…the Vaddas too may have borrowed that name from a concept that migrated to Sri Lanka from South India. And if you think Vaddas lack the verve to be concept borrowers, think about how they appropriated the origin myth of the Sinhalese and made Kuveni their ancestress.

According to G.C. Mendis (The Pali Chronicles of Sri Lanka: ed. 1996[vi], p71) “the Vijaya Legend, according to evidence available, is not a historical account. Its value lies in the fact that it is a literary work, an epic poem, a product of the mind” of the scholarly monks who wrote the chronicles. “The story of Kuveni is clearly derived from the Valahassa Jataka which seems to have influenced also the story of Simhala in the Divyadana”.

When G. C Mendis worked out the above hypothesis, did a question bang against the wall of his subconscious, as to how the Vaddas of Lanka came to own Kuveni and her unhappy love story which was a product of the mind of scholarly monks? Did he adequately consider all the steps in the pathway which led from the minds of the monks to the minds of the Vaddas?  Was it from the minds of the monks to the myth pool of the Sinhalese and from there to the myth-pool of Vaddas? Did G. C Mendis perhaps pause to consider that the Vaddas and the Sinhalese may have been bathing in a common myth-pool and this may be where the scholar monks got it? I bet not. I bet for Mendis too, the Vaddas were invisible. As invisible as they were to all the scholars who tried to derive the word “wanni” without giving a thought to the wanniyaletthos.

The Vaddas were far from invisible though. Take a look at the picture. It’s a VOC Map “Nieuwe Kaart Van Het Eyland Ceylon, Francoise Valentyn, J. van Braam et G.onder.de Linden” (1724-1726)[vii]. You will see the Vadda land (Het Land Der Weddas) and the Vanniya land (Het Land Der Wannias) existing side by side. You will also see that the land of the Vaddas covers the area corresponding to almost the whole district of modern Mulathivu north of Trincomally.

@ http://ratnawalli.blogspot.com/  and rathnawalli@gmail.com


[i] Let me mention a few glimpses of this equation between the Chakravartis or Suzerains of the centre and rulers of peripheries such as Jaffna:-

1)    The fourteenth century Medavala inscription (1961, The Arya Kingdom of North Ceylon JRASCB Vol. VII (New Series) Part 2) records a treaty between Vikramabahu III (1357-74 AD) and Marttandam, the Aryachakravarti ruler of Jaffna. The de-facto power advantage is obviously with Marttandam whose tax/tribute collectors, Vikramabahu has agreed to allow in his domains. And yet, the concept of suzerainty is explicit in the treaty, where “Martandam remains a “perumal” in contrast with the “Chakravarti Svamin,” that is, Vikramabahu (Paranavitana 1961; Somaratna 1975: 41-48). This is a telling sign of the symbolic hierarchies that organise overlordship and political authority.” –(Michael Roberts:2012).

2)    According to the lights of Phillipus Baldaeus it was from the Emperor Senarat that the Portuguese wrested Jaffna. He informs us (A True and exact Description of the Great Island of Ceylon: 1672; Pieter Brohier[i] translation; Ch.44, p316) that the Kingdom of Jafnapatan “remained under the Portugezen sway for upwards of 40 years, wrested from the Emperor by Philippo d’Olivero when he defeated the Cingalezen forces near Achiavelli by the great pagode…”

3)    Fernao de Queyroz too in “The Temporal and Spiritual Conquest of Ceylon” paints a clear picture of suzerainty. See Book I, Ch.7, p49(S.G. Perera translation)

“Of these the first that tried to free himself from the subjection to the king of Cota was Ariaxaca Varti, who being naturally proud and not brooking haughtiness of the officers of that king, took the life of the one that governed there, and the king of Ceylon preparing to punish him, they say, he went to meet him at Ceytavaca and took him some verses wherein he so flattered him with praises of him and his ancestors that he left him completely vainglorious and satisfied, and the verses being helped by a goodly present, he not only made him desist from war, but also obtained Olas from him (what we should call Provisions) and the title of King of Jafanapataõ, which his successors preserved paying in acknowledgment only some tribute; and because this was the beginning of their greatness, his descendants from the name Aria, were called Ariavance, which means, the generation of Aria”

There is another telling line about Sitavaka Rajasinha tucked away in Book 3, Chapter 12, p 469;

“On the death of Raju, whom the whole of Ceylon including Jafanapatao and the furthest of the Highlands obeyed…”

[ii] The earliest South Indian mention is the word “vanniya parru” occurring in the “inscription No. 556 of 1919, which appears to belong to the time of Rajaraja I (985-1014)”.-(K. Indrapala, “The Origin Of The Tamil Vanni Chieftaincies Of Ceylon”, Journal of the Humanities, July, 1970, Vol 1, No 2)

[iii]Vanni Bandara Vitti Potak: Rate Attange Niti kandaya

[iv] D. G. B de Silva, “New Light On Vanniyas And Their Chieftaincies Based On Folk Historical Tradition As Found In Palm-Leaf Mss. In The Hugh Nevill Collection, 1996: JRASSL, (New Series) Vol. XLI Special Number. (Published in 1998)

[v] See The Origin Of The Tamil Vanni Chieftaincies Of Ceylon”, Journal of the Humanities, July, 1970, Vol 1, No 2

[vi] This is a 1996 book which collects various articles by G.C. Mendis published in different journals.

[vii] I have cropped the map which appears on this article. Download the full map here.

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Latest comments

  • 8
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    Ratnawalli – now this is the most confusing piece of all. Because I like Vijya story the Mahavamsa version of it, where a bunch of royal hooligans where thrown out of India unfortunately landed in Sri Lanka. But then at leas,t it explains their continued bad behavior of th Sinhalese colonist in plaguing its inhabitants. Now that makes perfect sense. But now you say that all this is a story and that we all bloody South Indians – but that does not explain our moronic state. Please continue to enlighten us. We need it.

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      Dtarshabee Ratnavalli and Kiri Yakka………………………..

      “Was it from the minds of the monks to the myth pool of the Sinhalese and from there to the myth-pool of Vaddas? Did G. C Mendis perhaps pause to consider that the Vaddas and the Sinhalese may have been bathing in a common myth-pool and this may be where the scholar monks got it? I bet not. I bet for Mendis too, the Vaddas were invisible. As invisible as they were to all the scholars who tried to derive the word “wanni” without giving a thought to the wanniyaletthos.”……………

      History is full of such myth-pools originating from scholars, writers and even “Educated” philosophers…………………………………
      1. Salmon Rushdie’s Satanic verses in addition to the Monk Mahanams’s Mahawamsa, and the many Jataka Stories of Buddha’s previous births.
      ………………………………………………
      2. Ptolemy and Aristotle ideas claiming on the Geocentric Earth, believed even TODAY by 25% of the American, and more in the other parts of the world
      …………………………………………………
      3. The real Question is Did the Veddah Walk, or were they Kallathonis like the Sinhala and Tamils?.
      ………………………………………………………..
      4. We all know they originated from the Southern Indian Gene Pool. Read Below…..
      …………………………………………………………..
      http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Genographic_Project

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      Mahavamsa is the greatest Epic Poem written in Pali in Sri Lanka but as Ratnawalli very aptly points out, it is a product of the minds of the scholarly monks who wrote the Pali chronicles. Most of the mythical/supernatural stories and legends in the Mahavamsa were derived either from the Jataka Tales or from the Indian Epics and Puranas written in Sanskrit. For example, stories with names such as Pandu, Vasudeva , Simhala, Sinhala, Yaksha, Naga, Deva,, Raksaha, Lanka, etc are found in the Indian epics Mahabaratha, Bhagavad Gita, Ramayana, etc. I am sure the scholarly monks of the Mahavihara must have been very fluent in Sanskrit and very thorough with the Indian Epics, Puranas and the Jatakas and must have adopted all these stories (including the names) from them. The terms Lanka, Sinhala, Yakksha, Naga, etc are all copied from the Indian epics by the scholarly monks of the Mahavihara in the 4th Century AD. With the patronage of the Buddhist Kings, it is the Mahavihara monks who must have assimilated all the Buddhists from many different tribes together and called them Sihala (followers of Mythical Vijaya). To date, no archaeological evidence has been found to prove Vijaya’s arrival or existence. I hope M/s Ratnawalli will shed more light on these in her future articles for us to continue the process of unlearning and re-learning.

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        Saman,
        Even I feel that almost all the scholars who have analyzed the Mahavamsa had no much knowledge about Mahabaratha, Ramayana, Bagawath Gita, etc. The early chapters of the Mahavamsa have a lot in common with these Indian epics. It looks like to create a Sinhala society these scholarly monks have imagined/visualized a mass ‘Aryan migration’ from North India (Vijay story) during the proto-historic period. In reality, there is no objective evidence of an Aryan migration from North India; the ethnic structure in Sri Lanka (Sinhalese, Tamils, and Muslims/Moors) is quite South Indian with close affinities to Kerala, Tamil Nadu, Andara and Orrisa. Archeological and Genealogical discoveries in Sri Lanka using modern technology show that not only the Flora and Fauna but the people of South India and Sri Lanka are of the same stock (biologically) and culturally to a certain extent even though the major language/religion in Sri Lanka is much closer to North Indian. It is high time that some genuine (un-biased and non-political) Scholars engage in analyzing the Mahavamsa with respect to the Indian epics and highlight the similarities to understand the actual nature of our past.

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          “It looks like to create a Sinhala society these scholarly monks have imagined/visualized a mass ‘Aryan migration’ from North India (Vijay story) during the proto-historic period”

          I think it is not the venerable monk’s fault to devise a method to maintain hegemony of theravada buddhism during the decline of buddhism. but I find fault with aversion of demalas hidden in mahavamsa disintegrating the current social fabric of Srilanka.

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        Kiri Yakka,and Saman fernando If Vijaya story is true, and 700 women were brought here from India, then we are Sons and daughters of prostitutes – Vesige putthu and Vesige Doola!

        If this story is true, then that was the world’s first tart express, the others being to America and Australia.

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      Darshanie Ratnawalli seems to be an un-biased researcher and not inclined towards any political agenda. History is purely an academic discipline and should not be used as a political tool to undermine a nation or a group of people. The scholars and intellects that are engaged in research and write articles/essays on history should keep in mind that it is purely for academic and not political purpose. The only drawback in Darshanie’s approach is belittling the learnerd people for making some mistakes in their findings/papers. Being a good researcher, she may lose her credibility and fall to the status of a few ‘scholars’ who are engaged in cheap polemics and survolism (an interesting French word as someone mentioned in another article here) if she continues to mock at the academics. Otherwise, with her way of research, she has a very good future ahead to become a well respected erudite scholar.

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        P Sivakumaran ….. “Darshanie Ratnawalli seems to be an un-biased researcher and not inclined towards any political agenda.” …….. I beg to differ. ……. Definitely she has been working on a cunning plan to rewrite the history instructed by her Guru….. But then the plan is out in the open………. She habitually rubbishes all historians except the ones who write exclusively Sinhala/Buddhist history. If she continues to churn this kind of history one day when you wake up you will see nothing but a version of Mahawamsa written in English to suit majority Sinhala/Buddhist mind set…. She is going to deny my people ever lived in this island………

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        You would not say this and will take your words back if u have read what she wrote about “Kuragala” which is a new word. All of us know this as a place called “Jailani”, I am news buff, I have never read the word Kuragala until Buddhist extremist organization started claims against it recently.
        I agree with ‘Native Vedda’, her sole purpose is to distort history to benefit her master(s) pleasure (I meant ‘pleasure’ sarcastically)

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          Afzal
          CT readers have not forgotten Ms Ratnawalli’s interpretation of brammi based on prof paranavitana’s compostion when she penned a piece of writing “do your home work son” recently.

          Prof Paranavitana’s intepretation has not been accepted as genuine work. (Mr weerakody, lecturer in classical languages university of peradeniya)..

          I fail to see the insight of Mr P. Sivakumaran on his prediction of well respected erudite scholar.

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            ken robert …….. P Sivakumaran is being sarcastic.

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              Native
              I could not differentiate between sarcasm and critisism. I hope your elders could lend me a hand.
              Ken

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                ken robert ………… When a stranger praises one, one ought to be careful, the stranger may pull the rug from under. …..

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      Kiri Yakka, If Vijaya story is true, and 700 women were brought here from India, then we are Sons and daughters of prostitutes – Vesige putthu and Vesige Doola!

      If this story is true, then that was the world’s first tart express, the others being to America and Australia.

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    Kiri Yakka ……….. You are not only stealing my clothes but misappropriating my script, I do not have to remind you that I have some copy right over certain phrases. ………. However if you do employ them to bash origin of Sinhala/Buddhists please feel free to use them.

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      “|”bash origin of Sinhala/Buddhists please feel “|”
      _________________________________________________
      LANKA ALWAYS RULED FROM INDIA FROM 1500AD BY PORTUGESE . VASCO DA GAMA/ FRANCISCO DE ALMEIDA DURING THE BRITISH RAJ, HASTINGS FROM CALCUTTA!!
      _______________________________________________________
      Mongrels/Mughal, Rule of India, and the `RAPE` of Culture/Art/Architecture; Hindu/Jain/Buddhist.
      Mughal Empire was an empire extending over large parts of the Indian subcontinent and ruled by a dynasty of Chagatai-Turkic origin. The Mughal emperors were Central Asian Turko-Mongols from Uzbekistan, who claimed direct descent from both Genghis Khan (through his son Chagatai Khan) and Timur. Was a direct descendant of Genghis Khan through Timur and was the founder of the Mughal Empire after his victories at the Battle of Panipat (1526) and the Battle of Khanwa. At the height of their power in the late 17th and early 18th centuries, they controlled much of the Indian subcontinent, extending from Bengal in the east to Kabul & Sindh in the west, Kashmirin the north to the Kaveri basin in the south. Its population at that time has been estimated as between 110 and 150 million, over a territory of more than 3.2 million square kilometres (1.2 million square miles). The beginning of the empire is conventionally dated to the founder Babur’s victory over Ibrahim Lodi in the first Battle of Panipat (1526). It reached its peak extent under Aurangzeb, and declined rapidly after his death (in 1707) under a series of ineffective rulers. The empire’s collapse followed heavy losses inflicted by the smaller army of the Maratha Empire in the Deccan Wars, which encouraged the Nawabs of Bengal, Bhopal, Oudh, Carnatic, Rampur, the Nizam of Hyderabad and the Shah of Afghanistan to declare their independence from the Mughals. Following the Third Anglo-Maratha war in 1818, the emperor became a pensioner of the Raj, and the empire, its power now limited to Delhi, lingered on until 1857, when it was effectively dissolved after the fall of Delhi during the Indian Rebellion that same year. The reign of Shah Jahan, the fifth emperor, was the golden age of Mughal architecture. He erected several large monuments, the most famous of which is the Taj Mahal at Agra, as well as the Moti Masjid, Agra, the Red Fort, the Jama Masjid, Delhi, and the Lahore Fort. The Mughal Empire reached the zenith of its territorial expanse during the reign of Aurangzeb and also started its terminal decline in his reign due to Maratha military resurgence under Shivaji Bhosale. During his lifetime, victories in the south expanded the Mughal Empire to more than 1.25 million square miles, ruling over more than 150 million subjects, nearly 1/4th of the world’s population, with a combined GDP of over $90 billion.
      _______________________________________________________
      By the mid-18th century, the Marathas had routed Moghul armies, and won over several Mughal provinces from the Deccan to Bengal, and internal dissatisfaction arose due to the weakness of the Mughal Empire’s administrative and economic systems, leading to the declaration of independence by the Nawabs of Bengal, Bhopal, Oudh, Carnatic, Rampur, theNizam of Hyderabad and Shah of Afghanistan. In 1739, the Mughals were defeated in the Battle of Karnal by the forces of Nader Shah. Mughal power was severely limited and the last emperor, Bahadur Shah II had authority over only the city of Shahjahanabad. He issued a firman supporting the Indian Rebellion of 1857 and was therefore tried by the British for treason, imprisoned, exiled to Rangoon and the last remnants of the empire were taken over by the British Raj.
      ________________________________________________________

      Portuguese India
      The first Portuguese encounter with India was on 20 May 1498 when Vasco da Gama reached Calicut on Malabar Coast. Anchored off the coast of Calicut, the Portuguese invited native fishermen on board and immediately brought some Indian items. Later Calicut officials temporarily detained Gama’s Portuguese agents as security for payment. This, however, annoyed Gama, who carried a few natives and sixteen fishermen with him by force. Nevertheless, Gama’s expedition was successful beyond all reasonable expectation, bringing in cargo that was sixty times the cost of the expedition.
      ________________________________________________________

      The State of India, formally, Estado da Índia Portuguesa, and commonly Portuguese India, was a colonial state of the Portuguese Empire, six years after the discovery of a sea route between Portugal and India, to serve as the plenipotentiary governing body of a string of Portuguese fortresses and colonies overseas. The first viceroy was Francisco de Almeida, who established his headquarters in Cochin (Cochim, Kochi). Subsequent Portuguese governors were not always of vice-roy rank. Vasco da Gama sailed to India for a second time with 15 ships and 800 men, arriving at Calicut on 30 October 1502, where the ruler was willing to sign a treaty. Gama this time made a call to expel all Muslims (Arabs) from Calicut which was vehemently turned down. He bombarded the city and captured several rice vessels. He returned to Portugal in September 1503.The Portuguese built the Pulicat fort in 1502, with the help of the Vijayanagar ruler. On 25 March 1505, Francisco de Almeida was appointed Viceroy of India, on the condition that he would set up four forts on the southwestern Indian coast: at Anjediva Island,Cannanore, Cochin and Quilon.[4] Francisco de Almeida left Portugal with a fleet of 22 vessels with 1,500 men.
      Bombay (present day Mumbai) was given to Britain in 1661 as part of the Portuguese Princess Catherine of Braganza’s dowry to Charles II of England. Most of the Northern Province was lost to the Marathas of the Maratha Empire in 1739, and Portugal acquired Dadra and Nagar Haveli in 1779. After 1510, the capital of the Portuguese viceroyalty was transferred to Goa. Until the 18th Century, the Portuguese governor in Goa had authority over all Portuguese possessions in the Indian Ocean, from southern Africa to southeast Asia. In 1752 Mozambique got its own separate government and in 1844 the Portuguese Government of India stopped administering the territory ofMacau, Solor and Timor, and its authority was confined to the colonial holdings on the Malabar coast of India. At the time of British India’s independence in 1947, Portuguese India was subdivided into three districts located on India’s western coast: Goa; Daman (Portuguese: Damão) which included the inland enclaves of Dadra and Nagar Haveli; and Diu. The territories of Portuguese India were sometimes referred to collectively as Goa. Portugal lost effective control of the enclaves of Dadra and Nagar Haveli in 1954, and finally the rest of the colony in December 1961, when it was taken by India after military action (although Portugal recognised Indian control only in 1975, after the Carnation Revolution and the fall of the Estado Novo regime).

  • 1
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    I like these articles. Instead of the hundreds of monologues on Sri Lanka’s political, racial and religious problems, we have interesting essays on our common humanity.

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      “|we have interesting essays on our common humanity.”|writer “Vulgar Valli!!” Vulgar Valli”!!

      Better still a Harry Potter! (^‿◕) (@_@)
      _____________________________________________________

      Apple Corps; Then worm your way out of that one, then!! ◕‿◕ (^‿◕)

      http://www.youtube.com/watch?list=RDtUIu6_eTkjY&v=ygI-2F8ApUM

      BRODYQUEST 。◕‿◕。 。◕‿◕。

  • 1
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    A little known Batticalo writer from a village called Vellaveli, his real name I do not know but his pen name is ” Vellavur Gopal” wrote a book on the same subject as above in Tamil titled ” Thamilaga Vanniyarum Eelathu Vanniyarum” which contained a numerous useful information on the subject of Vanniyars in South India and Srilanka . I believe this book will be available at Batticalo university library. There are other writers from Vanni such as Arua – selladurai a television journalist who had written a five part series on Vanni ( Addankkapattu history) in Tamil followed by the Vanni’s current heriditary chieftain Hon .V.P.Lingajothy himself has written a book on Vanni history entitled ” The last Grreat Rebellion of Vanni- march 1877- may 1878″ .

    This book deals with the history of Vanni and it’s connection to Jaffna Kingdom and the Kandyan Kingdom to the last quarter of the 19 th century including the Kandyan rebellions and the help given by Vanni Chieftains such as his Great, Great, Great grand father Pariyary Velar to the Kandyan Disawa keppitipola to over throw the British from Sinhale and Eelam.

  • 0
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    A little known Batticalo writer from a village called Vellaveli, his real name I do not know but his pen name is ” Vellavur Gopal” wrote a book on the same subject as above in Tamil titled ” Thamilaga Vanniyarum Eelathu Vanniyarum” which contained a numerous useful information on the subject of Vanniyars in South India and Srilanka . I believe this book will be available at Batticalo university library. There are other writers from Vanni such as Arua – selladurai a television journalist who had written a five part series on Vanni ( Addankkapattu history) in Tamil followed by the Vanni’s current heriditary chieftain Hon .V.P.Lingajothy himself has written a book on Vanni history entitled ” The last Great Rebellion of Vanni- march 1877- may 1878″ .

    This book deals with the history of Vanni and it’s connection to Jaffna Kingdom and the Kandyan Kingdom to the last quarter of the 19 th century including the Kandyan rebellions and the help given by Vanni Chieftains such as his Great, Great, Great grand father Pariyary Velar to the Kandyan Disawa keppitipola to over throw the British from Sinhale and Eelam.

  • 3
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    “The key word is “diverse cultural milieus” of South India.”
    _____________________________________________________________

    Little brat go get a hair cut rather than try to fuckshit Indian History or Art, Architecture which is well documented- The Deccan not South India a name cemented 1947 (or 500 years ago by Spanish – hindu- indu)
    _____________________________________________________________

    Sanchi is the oldest structure and was originally commissioned by the emperor Ashoka the Great in the 3rd century BC. – There is nothing there to say that there was a vermin called Vijaya sent to Lanka. However, some decoits have carved on a rock at New Delhi “I sent my son vijaya to lanka” in hindi! So much for schedule caste happiness.

    The last battle was for the Deccan by Hastings 1818. The mongol/mughal conquest changed the hindu/jain landscape and architecture of Baharat forever.

  • 4
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    Rathnavali,
    What we need now is not another interpretation of Sri Lankan history like Mendis. Let things be clear. When the population of Sri Lanka is 75% Sinhalese, 12% Tamil and 8% Muslims anybody with a sane mind can know who are the immigrants. In the past even Elara’s people lived in peace with Sinhalese. Let us forget dwelling into past and promote one Sri Lanka where everybody Sinhalese, Tamils, Muslims and others live in harmony in every part of the country as one community working towards a better Sri Lanka finding way to communicate peacefully and shape up the future generations to think as Sri Lankan one nation one country. Let us journalists, intellectuals, politicians, religous leaders and public work towards one goal to unite Sri Lanka abd make us prosper.

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      Neutral …….. There is no one Sri Lanka, no one nation, no one country. You can unite the people only by accepting diversity. …….. You can unite the people only by removing Vijaya myth from text and history books………… You can unite the island only by forgetting 75%, 12% and 8% …… You can unite people only by assuaging the fear of assimilation among minorities. You can unite people only by good governance…. You can unite people only by restoring the democratic rights of all people…… There are millions of other things could help unity. ……. Think about it, words do not mean a thing to my people….. As long as the majority believes that this island exclusively belongs to them you will fail in your endeavours though it is a beautiful feeling and noble thought.

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      Neutral

      What about the original natives of Sri Lanka?

      75% Sinhalese, 12% Tamil and 8% Muslims??? You have only mentioned all the immigrants, what about the natives, the Veddhas???
      Are they even less than 8%???

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      Neutral,

      “When the population of Sri Lanka is 75% Sinhalese, 12% Tamil and 8% Muslims anybody with a sane mind can know who are the immigrants.”

      From the above statement, since Sinhalese are a majority, are you trying to imply that the Tamils, Muslims and even the Veddas are immigrants just because they are minorities where as the Sinhalese are original natives because they are a majority???

      The Sinhalese became a majority only after the European Colonials came to Sri Lanka. In the 16th century, the Portuguese and in the 18th century, the Dutch who occupied the island brought in tens of thousands of people from South India (mainly from Cochin in the Malabar coast/presently Kerala and from Tutucorin in the Coromandel Coast/presently Tamil Nadu) and settled them in the Southern parts of the island from Puttalama up to Matara as menial laborers (for growing/peeling cinnamon – today known as Salagama caste, for fishing/pearl diving – today known as Karawa caste, coconut planting/plucking and toddy tapping – today known as Durawa caste, and for many other jobs). Within a few centuries, the Sinhala population in the South (low country) increased exponentially when these people assimilated with the local Sinhala population by adopting the Sinhala language/culture and the Buddhist/Christian religion and getting converted to Sinhala Buddhists and Sinhala Catholics. Today their descendents (6th generation from the South) are not only claiming the ancient Sri Lankan civilization as their own ‘Sinhala’ heritage but have also become the patriots and champions of Sinhala-Buddhist chauvinism. They have become distinct, ‘North Indian Vijaya’s Lion-blooded Sinhala Aryans’, the Nationalist Patriots and guardians of the country (Sri Lanka) and its Religion (Buddhism), the job that Lord Buddha assigned to the Hindu God Vishnu as per the Mahavamsa. If these so called “Sinhaputhra/Boomiputhra of Heladiva” had remained as Tamils, (without assimilating with the Sinhalese) today the Tamils would have been the majority in Sri Lanka or if they had assimilated with the Veddas instead of Sinhalese, today the Veddas would have been considerably a large population in Sri Lanka.

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        Well said Suresh! Neutral seems to a very inteligent guy to think that if you are a majority in a country, that means you are not an immigrant. If you take countries like Australia and North America, the whites are the majority. As per our friend Neutral’s logic, the whites must be the natives and the red Indians must be immigrants because they are the minorities. Good logic Neutral, please take care of your brains.

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    This comment was removed by a moderator because it didn’t abide by our Comment policy.For more detail see our Comment policy https://www.colombotelegraph.com/index.php/comments-policy-2/

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    Rat on Walli, Its high time you play with my name dear.

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      errr , stop playing with your thing . idiot.

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        Borrowed Amude Pistola Hide and Squeak!!! eek eek Poof!

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    Ratnawalli dear village intellectual, we need those like you to pour kerosine on the land that is burning. To create divisions. To re-enforce idiotic concepts of race – that is long lost its credibility within the scientific community since Adolf Hitler commissioned the book Mein Kamp by racist authors. He would have loved your work, but after reading your stuff gassed you for not putting the Ariyans in top of all these Native Squabbles. Dear village girl your learned discourse sounds like this to me :

    I recently spoke to “Kalu Banda” then I spoke to “Suddhu Banda”. Kalu Banda told me that Sudhu Banda is a Yakka but then when I spoke to Suddhu Banda he told me that it is Kallu Banda is a Yakka. But then when I read the Mahavamsa – I find that they are both from Bandarawella and that they are related to Kiri Yakka even though their ancestors complained about paying some Kappam to Kiri Yakkas great grand father.

    Wake up village girl. Please stop entertaining us here. If you are keen to know where you came from – treat your self to a genetic test. For a good 250$ you will relive your self of the Sinhalese Identity Crisis – to stop the cocktail of race, religion and language cooking your small village mind.

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      Kiri Yakka: ….” I recently spoke to “Kalu Banda” then I spoke to “Suddhu Banda”. Kalu Banda told me that Sudhu Banda is a Yakka but then when I spoke to Suddhu Banda he told me that it is Kallu Banda is a Yakka. But then when I read the Mahavamsa – I find that they are both from Bandarawella and that they are related to Kiri Yakka even though their ancestors complained about paying some Kappam to Kiri Yakkas great grand father.”………………………………………………….. Kiri Yakka.. Sorry I am lost…. Who is related to who, how, when, where, why,… Could you talk me through your maze again. Finally who did sleep with who? ………. Why didn’t you give the same advice to Bandu de Silva’ who would be delighted to trace his ancestry back to Portuguese Aristocracy?

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      This is idiotic dribble . studying history is not racist . I dont think there is anything that rathnavali has said that can be construed as racist .

      if you take your mouth off the gal arraku botele you will relalize that you are behaving like a village simpleton just like kalu banda or sudu banda you are referring to .

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        Abhaya ………. “studying history is not racist” …… I hate to agree with you……… Selective reading and rewriting fiction as history are racist acts…. Banda and yourself should be proud about it but not the well informed ones.

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      $99 is all it takes to do a genetic ancestry test from 23andMe.

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    Kiri Yakka man ,what the devil are you talking? Don’t insult this girl Rathinavalli for once she seems to be saying something sensible and intellectually acceptable. By the way kiri devil what is your grouse with this damsel? For heaven sake lay off her man or devil or what ever you are. What Rathinavalli seemed to be saying is after all all the people in Srilanka are some how related to one another and that they are all Dravidians and primarily from South India . Thanks to GC Medis, Indirapala etal the truth has at last been established that is ; the Kalu Sinhalayas are no Aryans but Davidians like every body else in this region .

    Anagarika Dharmapala , Max muller and other romantic orientalists must be turning in their graves .Let us tell our Sinhala brothers that We Tamils are their nearest of relatives and they need not live with a complex of insecurity any more. All I am going to ask my Sinhala brothers is that please can you now with draw your army fom your brothers backyard. In view of our relationship it is not too much to ask. Hope the Sinhala army returns to heir native villages soon voluntarily.

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    Native Veddda,
    You are revealing your true identity. Behind your smoke screen, you area a Sinhalese-basher.You cannot be a Dambana Vedda.Must be from Mulliyaveli.You know what that means.Look at the pictures of those Vanni people in refugee camps. How many look Sri Lankan Tamils with their good features. Don’t they look more Estate [Indian]Tamil and Veddoid?

    UNW

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      U-no-who …………. Reread my comment: ………..However if you do employ them to bash origin of Sinhala/Buddhists please feel free to use them.

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    Dear Kiri yaka and other Yakas,

    No one in his /her senses will believe that Dharshanie Rathnawalli is a “village intellectual”.Rather , she is sophisticated and quite well read and writes sense.
    Please do not bring in narrow interpretations to liberal writing.

    Another yaka

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    Abhaya, “studying history is not racist” true. But interpretation of it can be. Adolf Hitler demonstrated that and so does the Mahavamsa, but thankfully it includes all the misdeeds of the Sinhalese. The concept of race is long obsolete and only village intellectuals hang on to it. Time for Rathnawalli to wake up and understand that even according to the Mahvamsa all our ancestors were in bed with each other – except the native Vedahhs who are quite J about it. Have you read about Queen Anulla – she was really cool.

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    Tadpole(゜゜)~simplistic to imagine Sri Lanka as a setting where South Indian concepts/conditions get duplicated en mass as if traced by carbon paper.(゜゜)~

    “Vulgar Valli-CUT” ಠ_ಠ. “Vulgar Valli-CUT” ಠ_ಠ
    “Vulgar Valli-CUT” ಠ_ಠ. “Vulgar Valli-CUT” ಠ_ಠ
    “Vulgar Valli-CUT” ಠ_ಠ. “Vulgar Valli-CUT” ಠ_ಠ
    ____________________________________________________________

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tUIu6_eTkjY

    Haircut, Haircut, Haircut, Haircut, Haircut,。◕‿◕。 o-o ◕‿◕

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      Javi, your nonsense sounds like the ravings of a Madman!

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        Who is?? Who is?
        [Edited out]

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        “|”your nonsense sounds like the ravings of a Madman!”|”

        Whats bothering attu patti fuckshit in new found illusion?

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    Morality is of the highest importance – but for us, not for God – Albert Einstein
    _____________________________________________________________
    Sinhala Supremacy has no place in society for 65 years they have murdered, disenfranchised and robbed.☻|☻ … we all call you the wonder girl in the political field??Because, we all wonder when you’re going to wash! Because you are not Japan that massacred the whole of asia. “|”“amateur historians who write without abiding by the protocols of the profession “|”- means “Cheap Shot Artist” (@_@) (@_@)
    ______________________________________________________________

    Civilizing the island started in 1505. The Arabs and later the Spaniards went to Kerala in search of `pepper corn` where the Jewish refugees (driven by Romans) had set up business and still do.
    All Lankan rulers came from the DECCAN the silk route. There is no royalty left- the last king (kotte sri wickremaraja sinh) relative a bachelor died a couple of decades ago.o-o ◕‿◕
    _____________________________________________________________
    Mesopotamia , Ziggurat was made of clay- the Arabs did not come from the Nile to Lanka to stay.
    Spanish Tiles: Mission Clay Roof Tile S type; Sinhala ulu same as `Mission Clay Roof tile.`
    Aryan died with Hitler and his square head German researches with the end of WW2. Hitler stole the Hindu script Swastika and have patent righted 1489 items of Sanskrit. The Sinhala Buddhist Supremes’ (schedule class) have hijacked Sanskrit of the Hindu Brahmin.。◕‿◕。 ☻ ◕‿◕
    ______________________________________________________________
    Spanish Roofing S type Rustic Antique Red, Dark /Light, `Mission Clay Roof Tile`
    Supremacy you had only the borrowed Amude from Veddha, no Dictionary no language but you are inventing the wheel as if reinventing- stupid morons, therefore the cannibals- extreme right wing thinking of the monks. Personal effects after `Amma`
    1 English; Shirt Spanish: Camisa; Sinhala: Amude/Camisa
    2 English: Shoe; Spanish: Zapato; Sinhala: Amude/Sapatu
    3 English: Towel Spanish: Toalla; Sinhala : Amude/Toalla
    4 English: Table Spanish: Mesa; Sinhala : Amude/Mesa
    5 English: Closet Spanish: Armario; Sinhala : Amude/ Armario
    6 English: Space; Spanish: Sala; Sinhala: Amude/Sala

    Happiness can exist only in acceptance not by hoodwinking.
    4th Feb – wasn’t that Independence day??? 。◕‿◕。 ☻ ◕‿◕
    _____________________________________________________________
    Freedom is the right to tell people what they do not want to hear.-George Orwell –Poppycock foundation laied in circa1948– Mahawamse 。◕‿◕。 。◕‿◕。

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    If these South Indian Vanniyans have been camping all along , the 2600 years that the Sinhala Buddhists are recorded as living in this Island, how come the latter grew to be a phenomenal 75% whilst the former only 15% even after counting the 5% legal and illegal real South Vanniyans from the 19 and 20 century?…….

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      Sumansekera, in reply to your query, they changed their names like you, from Sumanasekeran to Sumanasekera, Gunaratnam to Gunaratne, Mahendran to Mahendra and then to Mahinda. They even changed their Caste to the currently dominant One! Now do you understand how they became the massive 75%? Do not divide this Country “By narrow Domestic walls”, we are all one people!

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        Rationalist, what about the royal names of Tamil Nadu, the Sinhalese have taken them directly. For example, Kulothunga, Vira Wickrama, Kulasekara, Parakrama, Rajasekara were kings of Tamil Nadu.

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        Rationalist, The question is why did they change ……I will be with you all the way to prevent this Country being divided by either Domestic or International Walls…to satisfy the whims and fancies of non inhabitants and non Citizens …

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          non inhabitants and non-citizens?

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          It’s a simple process of naturalization. Those immigrants who settled in the South assimilated with the Sinhalese (Sinhalization) where as those who settled in the North assimilated with the Tamils (Tamilazion). The Sinhala nation comprises of people from various ethnic groups from India (North and South) that has been naturalized in the Sinhala way of life. The same is true for the Sri Lankan Tamil Nation also.

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          Sumanasekeran, do you fall into the category of “non inhabitants and non Citizens …” who want to divide ad destroy the Country?

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        Rationalist ………”we are all one people!” No definitely not, check your DNA, we are different….

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          Yes Native Veddah. let us all check our DNA. We should come out with some interesting Data.

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      “|” ..grew to be phenomenal..”|”_____________________ಠ_ಠ

      You odd-toed ungulate! Blistering Sinas,it’s the barnacle!Blistering YETTI!
      samalala-kanda.________。◕‿◕。 。◕‿◕。

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      K.A Sumanasekera, Before you ask the Tamils, you should ask the Veddhas who lived in the island for more than 2600 years, how did the immigrants from North India (Sinhalese) became a majority while the Veddhas became a very visible minority???

      For more details, please read above what Suresh has written.

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        Prasad, Who would be better qualified than our friend Native Vedda to answer you query !!!!

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          K.A Sumanasekera ….. During the last 2500 years of your genocide of my people we had lost many of our walking libraries and encyclopaedias. …….. Give them back we will let you know. …… I remember your people only recently wiping out books and oola in a library too. …….. This is an act of generosity on the part of Sinhala/Buddhists to erase all traces of history. …. Did you rejoice when Jaffna library was burned down by the Sinhala/Buddhists thugs, police and armed forces? ………… If you hadn’t this is the time to celebrate, go on open a champagne, stick up a finger at Cameron, Wiggy, Sam, Suma. and others who illegally occupied the library for a brief period of time. ….. Be a man,send in your JHU, Ravanas, BBS and others once again……. Then there will be no traces of any history.

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            Dear Native,……Even Cameron wouldn’t have believed that it is the same Library that you are referring to…if you had seen his gleaming handsome face, looking at his new Vellala supporters from the 3rd Floor of the Jaffna Library Building…….Your Chief in Mahiyangana too now cruises in a Nissan Double Cab…How good is that?…Just imagine if he was in real Vanni…Prabkaran would have banished the whole clan to Sinhala Buddhist Land, the same way he dispatched the indigenous Muslims in the North East….So don’t worry , They are now in good hands although you are not there to see them…..

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      Since Whites are the majority in Australia and North America, they must obviously be the indegenous inhabitants of those 2 continents. — All yuor posts are just troll posts, absolutely devoid of logic , facts and basic honesty.

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      I am manisekaran, if you cant spell you will call alter me as manisekare and I become sinhalese, clear???

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    Piraña & Ranjith, thanks for pointing this out. Ratnavalli is not a village intellectual. Having read her blog, It is clear that she has a serious interest in what she is on about. I respect that. So my apologies to Ratnavalli.

    Its just that I find the whole thing of who is who a very sickening feudal obsession that feeds ongoing feuds. We need to get over that as we are well on our way to cultural extinction.

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    VANNI is PALI word for FOREST.

    Pallava King Narasimha Varman defeated the Chalukya PulakesiII in 642CE. Deccan, now the state of Karnataka was under the rule of Chalukya rulers.

    In the war of VATAPI, the Sri Lankan prince MANA VA(R)MMA also participated and got the help from the Pallava Narasimha to capture power in Sri Lanka.

    Mana Vamma ruled Lanka from 692 to 726.

    The forest dwellers of Karnataka were enslaved and brought to Tamil nadu under the Pallava Narasimha. Those people are known as “VANNIYAN”. Those Vanniyans were agriculture slaves in Tamil nadu. Those vanniyans of Tamil Nadu use the flag of Chalukya even today. The flag is with a picture of PIG even today. That shows their Karanataka origins.

    The Vanniyans of Karnataka still speak KANNADA.

    I hope the Pallava connection and their PALI usage gave the name VANNI.

    All the forest areas were known as VANNI in Sri Lanka. That is why the VEDDAS have names like “VANNIYA”.

    Present day Vanni of Lanka contain more KERALA/Tamil names and nothing of Karanataka.

    In Tamil nadu all the castes are now trying to connect them with the old Royals. For example the PALLAN caste claims the Raja Raja Chola was a PALLAN. That is a comedy but many fools are there to believe it!

    Vanniyans claims of VAHNI and AGNI KULA is another comedy.

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      stupid explanation! This is what screwing with little knowledge. Even in early vedic period, when varna system was introduced as way of life, people were categorised as four classes, namely bramhana, khastriya,vysya and sudra. Vanniyar people were present those days not just in TN, but also in whole of south India. Vanniyars of south India belonged to this khastrya group and were war mongerers. They were people belonging to thinai “mullai”

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        Vanniyan Ramadas and his criminal activities are not for any Kshatriya clans.

        Vanniyans of Tamil nadu were agri laborers to Vellalas and others. They still use the PIG FLAG as theirs because they were brought from Karnataka forests of Chalukyas.

        Every Kshatriya caste has their own GOTRA and emblems. Do you know anything about those matters?

        Vanniyans of TN cry they are “VANNIYA KULA KSHATRIYAS”. That is joke. Every human has a “fighting” mentality. It does not mean they are Kshatriyas of Brahmanical order!

        Kshatriya is a caste and of Brahmanical origins. These forest dwellers of Ramadas cannot go up the ladders of Rajputs or Kshatriyas of Pallava origin.

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          Yet another studpity embarks in yoru writing.. Do you know anything about vanniyars? I am a person who lived in Vanniyar majoirty north Salem since my childhood. I understand your wikipedia reading did not help you much. can you cite reference of vanniyar flag using pig in it???

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            As usual you are another Tamil fool from Tamil nadu. Every caste in Tamil nadu has their flags and emblems. Vanniyan are of low caste origins from Karnataka. If you do not know about them, it is not my fault!

            Check with Ramadas, why he cried when Kannada forest brigand Verappan was killed!

            Now the Vanniyans bark that they are from the Pallava Royals. How is that? Dont you know it fool? Are you telling here that these vanniyans belong to Nandi Gotra or bharadwaja Gotra of the Pallava royals?

            Kshatriya castes have their GOTRAS but these Vanniyans have nothing. Then their Kshatriya claim also zero!

            Once this Ramadas came to canada for a LTTE conference. I asked him about the Kshatriya claims of vanniyans. He got shock and unable to answer and ran away!

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              Are you mentally retarded?

              “why he cried when Kannada forest brigand Verappan was killed” – how stupid that you can get, idiot?

              Veerappan was born in Salem district of Tamilnadu. He mostly lived in forest area of madeshwaran malai to sathyamangalam. Stupid, vanniyars of Tamilnadu comprise of people of category called “khastriyas of old varna systems” This sytem includes all communities except low caste sudras( Pariaya,vannan,arundhatiyars etc.) and vaishyas ( Ambalakarar, vaniyars etc) and brahmins. This khastrya caste in ancient days reprsent pesants, weavers, warriors, otrans, etc etc. Thats why even till date Vanniyars of TN comprise of Pandhal, padaytchi( who were poojari groups in Kali temples), palli, arasa padaytchi etc etc.

              Still you have not cited teh reference for your claim that their falg uses “pig”. I bet it is not as I had seen their falg, Dont lie in the forum.

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                Vanniyars are the only Kshatriya caste in Tamilnadu. Right from Tirupati to Nagapattinam it is the dominant caste. The Chennai name is derived from the Chennappa Naicker pattinam who once owned the land stretching in Marina beach. Vanniyar naickers are the native peoples of Chennai and Kanchipuram, now running multiple business in the city. Vanniyars has different titles Padayachi, Naicker, Gounder, Devar, Kander, Palli, Nainar. The kings who come to throne from Chidambaram temple are all Vanniyars. The Pichavaram jamin, Sivagiri jamin, Sambuvarayar, Pallavarayar, Kadavarayar, Mazhavarayar are all Vanniyars. Now Vanniyar youths are into all profession from business to science.

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        Manisekaran,
        You should read Pfaffenberger: Religious Foundations of Sudra Domination in Tamil Sri Lanka
        ________________________________________________________________

        Synopsis from TamilNation.org
        __________________________________________________________________
        “…The caste system of South India, epitomized (as are most things South Indian) by the social formation of the Tamil-speaking lands is if anything even more rigid and redolent of the hierarchical ethos than that of North India. And yet – here, of course, is the uniquitous paradox with which South Indian presents us – the Tamil caste system comprises features which are not only unknown in North India but are also without any clear foundation in the Sastric lore. So divergent is the southern system that one is tempted to say, with Raghavan (n.d.:117), that the Sastras have “little application” to the Tamil caste system, which should be analyzed in purely Dravidian terms…But to do so is to forget the fundamental challenge with which Dravidian culture presents us, namely, to see it as a regional variant of the Gangetic tradition of Hinduism. We are obliged to observe, for instance, that the highest and lowest ranks of the Tamil caste hierarchy – that of the Brahman and of the scavenging Paraiyar Untouchables -are perfectly explicable in Sastric terms. ..”

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    1. The author writes So much is this lack that the South Indian tradition has to painstakingly derive the word “vanni” from “vahni” (fire).

    I am intrigued. Because the words vanam, Vanathurkam, Vanaantharam (interior of a forest), Vanakkarar (inhabitants of a forest] etc exist in old Tamil. They may well have come to Tamil from Middle-Indian Prakrit and Old Sanskrit (I use the word sanskrit to include all forms, and not just the staylized form). The Guptan rulers pushed their power over the less advanced south and the early rulers of the nascent Tamil kingdoms were Guptan aristocrats who continued to marry fair-skinned North indian women.
    That the word Vana got preserved in Sri Lanka in a more clear sense is also not surprising. A long-shot connection that I have been toying around is that the word Ravana was simply a name for the King (Ra) of the Vana, viz, Raavana. So Ravana was simply a Vanniyar lord – i.e., some chieftain who lived in the forest region (of Sri Lanka) and decided to elope with an Indian queen! The myth may be a part of the myth pool that we have in Hellenic literature as well.

    In old literary Tamil Iravanam இராவணம் is to disguise one self and use the disguise for some cunning purpose (e.g., go to Rama’s abode and carry away Sita). The adding of the vowel I is common in early tamil, and also early Sinhla-(Elu)-pali/sanskrit transformation , e.g., rahath රහත් and arahath/arhanth,
    or, if we look at sinhala and Tamil place names, Ramamduwa and Iranamaduwa, Lanka and Ilankai etc.

    So, I am intrigued and surprised that historians have not noticed the possibility that the Ravana story may give antiquity of the vanniyar concept, a concept which applied to any Forest king, or even modern bandit kings like Veerappan who actually lived in the Deccan Vanni.

    In that sense, the Veddas did not need to ‘usurp’ the Vijaya myth and make Kuveni their queen. She was ‘Ku-veni’, i.e., dak-coloured, and Vijaya, the North Indian prince did not in the end want her as a queen. Instead he turned to the family of the Guptan King of Madura whose wives were from the Skyan clan, If the writer of mahawamsa had worked out all this in this utterly consistent manner, he had indeed written a great work with an incredibly self-consistent mind.

    Finally, I find that Gnanaprakasar is very poor when it comes to tracing how words evolved (Nishpanna) from mother languages.

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      You are right in explaining the name RAVANA but he was the son of a HINDU sage PULASTHIYA who was the father to KUBERA also. Kubera was the treasury keeper of the DEVAS of the HINDU HEAVEN.

      Ravana was a ruler of FORESTS and it has nothing to relate the Vanniyas to him. Normally rulers are not related to their subjects in the past!

      Now Mahinda is the ruler of Lanka. Is it mean that he is related to all Sinhalese, Tamils and Muslims? His clan is completely different!

      Vijaya went to Pandia to get women in Tamil nadu and not to the Northern Madura. Try to know the names TAMBA PANNI and Tamira BHRANI!

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        “|”nincompoopery!!
        ___________________________________________________
        Lies are sufficient to breed opinion, and opinion brings on substance!! (@_@)|(@_@)

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          You know how to fart but it never bring anything except nasty smell or laugh!

          If you do not know or understand, ask or read on the subject!

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            Ha ha he he!
            ____________________________________________
            Canadian refugee all methane no fart! Ha ha No one can change Baharat’s art, architectural, cultural, and linguistic past as it is well documented.

            ____________________________________________
            In Lanka a witch has sex with a lion to start evolution when there are no lions in SL or India.

            ____________________________________________
            But Marathi `Siva`ji the ancient tiger carries the flag because Baharat has real 4 legged tigers. Beware Shiv Senna don’t like embili.

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              Idiota!
              British emblem also carries LION. How is that? Did Queen Elizabeth come from a LION?

              You are a farter and tell here that Sinhalese believe lion stories but you beg British! So, you ask your British masters to explain their LION connection to the cold British isles!

              Check the Canadian High Commission in Panjab and you will find thousands of so called BHAARATS are lineup to be dish washers and toilet cleaners in Canada!

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                the singhs were from the kings army and the first immigrants and are are still respected- you are container siva the smuggling refugee.

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                  Idiota! I am not a refugee like you!

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                    Blood is thicker than water porikki container trash isnt it?

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        Why does Mr. Sivananthan say but he was the son of a HINDU sage PULASTHIYA who was the father to KUBERA also. Kubera was the treasury keeper of the DEVAS of the HINDU HEAVEN”? Does mr. Sivanathan feel that there is geographic continuity with the earth (where Ravana, the forest king lived), and the “HINDU HEAVEN”? Why does he just say “son of a Hindu sage Pulashthiya” without the slightest proof, purely based on one set of mythologies. As he knows well, there are different views about “Pulasthiya” even in different Indian texts.
        I humbly beg Mr. Sivanathan to attempt to distinguish human and divine matters, with the latetr merely a matetr of his own credulity or naivity. Tamils have to move out of obscurantism, and become a rational people. They have to get rid of Manu Dharma and such horrors that are attributed to so called sages (in fact, pure oppressors of people) like Pulashiya who are probably was a local thugs who controleld a temple, and then raised to the level of divinity by subsequent folk lore?

        And what is this stuff about how Mahinda is the ruler of Lanka. Is it mean that he is related to all Sinhalese, Tamils and Muslims? His clan is completely different! Can Mr. Sivananthan tell us what his clan is? Has he heard about DNA? The Tamils are a mongrel mixture of all those people who funneled down from the North, to the south, and all the sea-faring people who arrived on the Malabar and Coramandal coasts. The Sinhalese, I dare say, are no better, and form an equally random mixture. And Mr.Sivanathan probabaly thinks that he comes from some pure stock right from the head or the arm, or the belly, or perhaps even some unmentionable parts of the Brahma? No, he will not admit to that?

        This stuff about “clan” is where the Manu Dhrma and caste discrimination hide. The whole point is, Mahinda rajapaksa probably has as much Tamil genes (if there are such things), as Mr. Sivananthan has Sinhala genes (if there are such things).


        When will the new, educated, rational class of tamils arrive to displace these types who go rolling around the temples on all fours, offering animal sacrifices, and talking of Pulashiya and Thiru-gnana-smapnathar and other so called “munivars”?

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          Manoharan:
          Knowledge and Tamil and science have nothing in common. What is the Tamil/Sinhala idiotic politics? On what base the so called Tamil or Sinhala politics has evolved?

          Only MYTHS are the base.

          Explain about the parents of Ravana if you know because Rama-Ravana controversy is a political issue even today. Tamil fools bark RAVANA was a TAMIL and Dravida.

          Are you telling here to believe those stories and claims?

          Speaking a language is a superior politics for Tamils and Sinhalese.

          I know my history very well. Dont bother about me but come to the point.

          Tamils and Sinhalese are believers of 2000, 2500, 10000 years of myths in their daily politics.

          There is no Tamil gene or Sinhala gene in DNA.

          I think you are not a HINDU and a follower of Fr. Emmanuel who cried the LTTE was the divine soldiers of Christ.

          So, dont try to fool Hindus or Thiru Gnana Sambanthar here to please your Christian masters!

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            Please answer my question. Which clan do you belong to?
            I don’t support father Emmanuel and other obscurantists who are the tail end of the Portuguese colonization of south asia.
            According to you “Rama-ravana controversy is a political issue”
            Indeed, as long as obscurantists who talk of Pulasthiya or Abraham or Jesus or Mohamad rule people’s minds, that will be the case. The south of US, and by extension rich western Evangelists propagate their myths. Then there is the Saudis with their myths. Then there is the Hindthva types (is that your clan) with their Pulastiya myths.

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              What do you mean by clan? You mean caste? I have none!

              In India the caste system is now enshrined as a legal part of the society. Sri Lanka has no legal status for any castes but caste based political formations are there. All of them claim they are “high” castes. That is a myth and many are happy to share it!

              LTTE is supported by the VVT smugglers and their fishing counterparts because the fishing folks thinks they are superior to others because of VVT smugglers and their Tamil political involvement!

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          Manoharan ………. “to displace these types who go rolling around the temples on all fours,” …… I am sorry how do you roll when you are on all fours? “offering animal sacrifices,” …. Do humans look like animals to you?…… In this island only the ritual human sacrifice takes place ……….

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          “|”When will the new, educated, rational class of tamils arrive to displace “|”
          ________________________________________________
          They are already there demolishing and lighting the Mihin temple on poya courtesy daily noise.
          The sun god who is neither pakistani, indian, or lankan, but wears Gujarati costume is the apple that carries the maggot even for the British to China.
          ________________________________________________
          VVT fisherman has no fish that’s his fate- varade puli poo padippu.!
          。◕‿◕。|。◕‿◕。

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      The Mahavamsa says
      about the matter, sent people, entrusted with many precious gifts, jewels, pearls, and so forth, to the city of Madhura[16] in southern (India)
      http://mahavamsa.org/mahavamsa/original-version/07-consecrating-vijaya/

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      The Gupta empire originated around 240 CE and it height was under Chandragupta (reigned c. 319–335 CE)._________________________________________________________
      So the whole thesis of Vijaya (if historical around 500 BCE) marrying Gupta Kings of Madura (if they ever existed) is impossible.____________________________________________
      http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gupta_Empire

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    DECCAN Black cotton soil know their oranges like sound of silence.
    Thanjavur RULE:`Siva`ji Maratawada

    H.H. Choladesadhipati Srimant Rajasri Maharaja Kshatrapati Sri Shivaji Raje Sahib Bhonsle Chhatrapati Maharaj, Raja of Tanjore
    • Shahaji Raje (1594–1664)
    • Ekoji I (1676–1684). Half-Brother of Chattrapati Shivaji Maharaj
    • Shahuji I of Thanjavur
    • Serfoji I
    • Tukkoji
    • Ekoji II
    • Sujanbai
    • Shahuji II of Thanjavur
    • Pratapsingh of Thanjavur
    • Thuljaji
    • Serfoji II
    • Shivaji II

    Hanuman ki Jai

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    Judging from the article and the comments, it appears that we are a Nation yearning to live in the past and has no desire to work for a better future. A Nation wallowing in past. Granary of the East. Two thousand year history. Aryan blood. The supreme race sired by a Lion. Mahawamsa. Jathaka Stories etc. etc. When will we come down to earth?

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      Past truths or myths are the present day political tools. Sinhalese and tamils are living side by side for centuries. Then how the Sinhalese start to tell they came from North india.

      I have seen both Sinhalese and Tamils are from the same stock of people. KINGS came and went.

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        “|”Sinhalese and tamils are living side by side for centuries.”|”

        From 1505 the rule was from Baharath and malabaries etc were transported.
        1948 was an accident- like the story of the prodigal son for 64 years.
        To put this carnage to rest an external intervention is a necessity. To many lies from Mahawamsa surfaced after 1948 due to european imports of people to work in the estates as there were no locals.

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          Javi did you remember to take your Anti Schizophrenic pill today? You sound completely sane!

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    Vanniyars are one of the most downtrodden castes in Tamilnadu.They have traditionally worked as agricultural labourers are helpers for upper caste Gounders,Mudaliyars and Vellalars for many centuries.Many caste like Kallar,Thevar,Udayar have vanniyar titel.Vanniyar is not a titel for a single caste.

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